However, YOU SHOULD upgrade your driving skills, suspension, brakes, and tires before touching the engine

You are correct, many people think that more power=faster times

 

I think we are finally on the same page.
I also completely agree that you should upgrade the handling before you get the power. If not fully, at least the tires and then get a feel of the power and go from where with your suspension.

 

Way to Highjack this guys thread

 

I did send him a PM with the invoice prices for the 06 S2000.

 

Better (faster) drivers on a road course are faster because they can USE more power. Slower drivers use less power (they go slower) because they get on the gas later, brake earlier decreasing their speed down the straight, etc.

Obviously it is more difficult to exit a corner using the full potential of a car with 400hp than it is to control 110hp. Going full throttle in a 400hp miata is obviously going to cause massive amounts of oversteer, or in a civic with 400hp you will cause massive amounts of understeer due to wheelspin, lol.

Often, upgrading the handling of a car will make it even more difficult to drive at the limit since the limit is even higher. A good example of this is the switch from street tires to R-compound tires. It's easier to go fast with R-compound tires but if your rear end loses grip and you never learned how to countersteer.......... then..................

You can utilize engine upgrades on a drag strip but the maximum G's through a corner are the same regardless of 110hp or 400hp unless you tweak the suspension on the "modded" car. A 600hp STi (otherwise stock) will murder a stock 300hp sti around sears point, but it will just have to brake earlier and it will be more difficult for a driver to use all the power exiting a turn.

 

so the driver will have to handle the car differently with more power than the driver who is driving the STi with less power. Once again, I agree with you, but thanks for showing that power does affect handling.

 

*BANGS HEAD ON TABLE*

Just when I thought we were getting someone *bangs head on table*

Power DOES NOT EFFECT HANDLING, PERIOD!!!!. How much power you knowing how to use it is 100% DRIVER

Too much power and an inexperienced driver will effect TRACK TIMES, but it still doesnt effect handling at all

Track times and handling are also UNRELATED.

There are n00bs who run 14s in evos/stis. Thats 100% driver error

If someone has a high HP car and is always mashing it and getting off their lines, they will in turn go slower on a course. However, that doesnt mean the handling characteristics of the car changed at all, it simply means they suck at driving

 

You can utilize engine upgrades on a drag strip but the maximum G's through a corner are the same regardless of 110hp or 400hp unless you tweak the suspension on the "modded" car. A 600hp STi (otherwise stock) will murder a stock 300hp sti around sears point, but it will just have to brake earlier and it will be more difficult for a driver to use all the power exiting a turn.[/QUOTE]

why will it be more difficult for a driver to use all the power exiting a turn????
because the power effects how the car handles and therefore makes the driver change the line he will run and the way he enters and exits a turn.
what this reads to me is that because the guy has more POWER he has to HANDLE the car differently in the corner. Therefore to me, POWER effects how you HANDLE the car in corners.
maybe I am wrong, but I am pretty good are reading and comprehending.

 

are you pretty good are reading and comprehending? cuz i dont think anyone else thinks so.

it sounds like youve never driven at a track/timed event before because given the same suspension setup, you wouldnt really change your line if you had a higher horespower car. you might go faster on the straights with more power, but youd have to slow down to the same corner entry speed in order to successfully navigate your car through the corner. resident smurf just said that:

 

Haha.. Don't hurt yourself. You see why I stepped out a while ago? I used to spend time trying to explain stuff like this as if it were my responsibility or something. Now I try for a little while, and eventually give up before the banging of the head on a table ensues.

 

so basically you guys are saying that if you have a WRX with 300hp/300 ft lb torque and mod the engine up to 500hp/500 ft lb torque, the handling will be exactly the same on any track that you run it on?
is that what I am getting?

 

No need to degrade an individual here Yin.....

BUT.....in essence doesn't this state that with more power you have to alter YOUR handling of the car? Your handling can be Driver technique changes, and/or Suspension setting changes....

 

also, if the maximum g's are the same for a car with 110hp and 440hp, why is there different results on the skidpad??????? Maybe you can explain it to me so that I understand, but I just dont get where your coming from.

 

you are right. i apologize, 06wrx4me.

ok, driving technique will change because you need to slow down before entering a corner, but thats not suspension. maximum g's are just that, maximum. if you enter the corner at any higher speed (because you have more power), you will be beyond maximum g's, which means you go into the wall or dirt (driver error). if you are entering a corner at the same entry speeds and same maximum g's, that only means that the higher power car will have to slow down earlier or faster on the straight to reach the maximum corner entry speed. once you enter the corner, both situations are identical suspenions-wise.

 

what cars? what results are you talking about? i'm assuming you are referring to hard data in a publication.