all good bro.

 

This is very true. Working safety crew for NASA, you tend to see the results of misinformation in the form of twisted metal and such.

People read car mags, and look at a car's power @ a specific RPM no less, and think of it as an on/off switch. A ____ can beat a ____ in any number of situations based solely on the driver's skill and understanding of the platform he is using. PERIOD. I used to get so frustrated in NASA group3 in my 1980 Celica being held up by new STis and Boxsters. Does this mean underpowered cars are superior? That old beater Celicas are fast4r? No - it means those guys should not have been in Group 3. We have one guy in Group 2 with a new Z06 who would NOT listen to the instructor and eventually plowed his car into the wall on the back straight... Doesn't matter "how fast a car is" or "how well it handles" as long as there is a competent driver behind the wheel.

The biggest problem is people see the throttle as an on/off switch. It's not digital, it's analog!! Most good handling underpowered cars do well because they are momentum cars and force the driver to actually learn how to drive, unlike the Viper drivers in Group2 who putt putt around the corners holding everyone up, then drag race on the straights.

There is zero direct correllation between power and handling. It is ALL about the driver and his ability to control a car.

S2K's handle amazingly well but need a skilled driver as you approach the limit. WRXs are great handlers too but are MUCH more forgiving for a more unskilled driver.

If you are comparing a car's abilities solely on the output of it's engine at a specific RPM, then there is nothing really to talk about there...

 

w00t

+1 for more people who understand motorsports and vehicle dynamics

 

hahaha i got those bullet points straight from your posts. as you can see i am studying for teh GRE, cuz reading comprehension > me... usually.

 

my point is this, the more power you have, the more suspension and braking components you need. The fact you need to upgrade your brakes and put on new coilovers and swaybars because you have more power means that power does affect handling. They are two different components, but you can not have one without the other.

I understand that a mini or S2000 is built to handle better on a course just like a porsche is compact and built to handle well. but if you take a stock S2000 and then put motor upgrades and no suspension in an S2000 the stock one will handle better because the suspension is set up for the power of the car.

 

Did you not read ANYTHING anyone posted?

Just because you have the power, doesnt meant you NEED to upgrade the suspension. You just have to learn how to modulate and correctly use that power (100% driver, 0% car).

First mod-DRIVING SKILLS/classes
Second mod-suspension/brakes/tires (most stock cars motors out perform the stock suspension
third mod-power

Driving skill>>>>>buying parts. Buying aftermarket parts will NOT make you a better driver, it only (in some cases) makes the margain for error larger. IE, they make a a bad driver look not as bad

Please read back the past couple posts, they are informative and 100% correct, because you are completely missing the point right now. If you do upgrade your motor and you want to FULLY use that power, then use you must upgrade (see above about stock engines), but that doesnt mean HAVE to upgrade everything else

If an experienced driver and 2 stock suspension S2ks, one with stock engine, one with mods, he would still be able to go faster in the moded one on the stock suspension

Why? its called driver skill

 

I do agree that skill is needed, but your telling me that if i take an FP Green setup and put it on my 06 WRX and leave everything else stock I will be able to control the power. Your dead wrong. I will need new tires, handling, at the minimum.

 

*bangs head on table*

Re-read, again. Then read it one more time. Then once more for good measure. The suspension doesnt control the power, your right foot does.

 

i think the confusion for needing better suspension lies in velocity versus power. here's a situation: driver's skill aside, at high velocity, you need better suspension components to navigate through tough corners - this may be true. with more power under the hood, you can get to higher velocity faster (more acceleration), but thats it. with less power under the hood, you can still reach that same exact velocity in less time, but you will still need the same suspension upgrades regardless of horespower. so what brought the car to that velocity??? THE DRIVER!!!

 

no... they handle exactly the same.

one simply accelerates faster in a straight line. if you were to optimally navigate a course with both cars, you would enter/exit every corner at the same speed in order fully utilize your driver skill for least time. you can still go fast in the lesser power car.

 

dude thats YOU controlling the car. yeah if you had an fp green setup and drove it around at 200 mph then you might need new brakes and tires. but youd also need new brakes and tires if you had no fp green and went 200 mph anyway.

 

dude you're arguing for this:

against this:

i cant even think of anything to say to even sympathize with misinformed people who continue to try to make their point.

maybe we should stop. we are doing a dis-service to vendors everywhere. these are the same people who will buy every suspension/power component available because they think it will make them a better driver. by telling people the truth, people might start taking driving lessons and not get into wrecks. now that just wouldnt be american

 

+1 for buying parts

 

whats even better is how they keep talking about coilovers, sways, brakes, etc and are missing THEY most important upgrade (short of driving skill)

TIRES. The only thing that actually touches the road. Doesnt matter how stiff and tuned your suspension is or how huge your brakes are if you are rolling on stock RE092s

 

sorry that I never did mention tires, the things that touch the ground.

I understand where you guys are coming from, but its confusing me. Why mod your engine if you are going to run the same lines because your suspension isnt modded. Why is the fastest STi on a track near stock HP, but is modded like crazy in the body and suspension?