I knew this day would come :(
10-31-2015, 01:34 PM
#47
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Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Union City
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Car Info: 16' R, 14' WRX, 04' MSM
Bah. Me too. 2014 WRX with 33k on the clock spun a bearing. Oil pick up tube failure. 
I got a quote from GST for rebuilding the current block but while I save my pennies for that and upgrades I'm doing my due diligence to find the best shop for my situation. Anyone know what machine shop they use?
Undecided if I want to re-build the current block or just swap in a brand new built short block.. Also looking at the efr7163 iwg full race kit since staying with the stock turbo would just be silly at this point.
I got a quote from GST for rebuilding the current block but while I save my pennies for that and upgrades I'm doing my due diligence to find the best shop for my situation. Anyone know what machine shop they use?
Undecided if I want to re-build the current block or just swap in a brand new built short block.. Also looking at the efr7163 iwg full race kit since staying with the stock turbo would just be silly at this point.
10-31-2015, 03:41 PM
#48
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2014 - aren't you still under warranty?
I ended up using Outfront Motorsports. They have a great rep and were directly recommended by Bill (the tuner)
Unfortunately, I can't really speak to much else as I haven't gotten the motor back yet.
I will say that on 2 occasions Outfront have, directly lied to me about the motor being done and crated. Although frankly every good machine shop I've ever dealt with has pulled crap like that.
Supposedly the engine is with a freight company and being delivered on Monday. I'll update you guys after it gets here and I can put eyes on it
I ended up using Outfront Motorsports. They have a great rep and were directly recommended by Bill (the tuner)
Unfortunately, I can't really speak to much else as I haven't gotten the motor back yet.
I will say that on 2 occasions Outfront have, directly lied to me about the motor being done and crated. Although frankly every good machine shop I've ever dealt with has pulled crap like that.
Supposedly the engine is with a freight company and being delivered on Monday. I'll update you guys after it gets here and I can put eyes on it
Last edited by Lowend; 10-31-2015 at 03:45 PM.
10-31-2015, 05:43 PM
#49
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Join Date: Jan 2014
Location: Union City
Posts: 50
Car Info: 16' R, 14' WRX, 04' MSM
Yeah. However, I had turboback, intercooler and FP done. Pretty sure they would have just denied warranty and since I was initially wanting it fixed asap I didn't feel like having to argue with them over it.
Since I'm now going the upgrade route, it's moot anyways. I was looking at outfront's short blocks, as well as LIC's, which are across the country, among several others.
It's tough to find a shop that will always do right by you. The ones that get high recommendations also tend to be super busy, which allows them to charge a premium and there's always a possibility that something doesn't get checked properly during the build with that high of a turnover. I guess you just have to do your due diligence in finding a reputable shop and roll the dice, which is a lot to swallow with how much building these engines costs.
Good luck with the build, looking forward to seeing how it turns out.
Since I'm now going the upgrade route, it's moot anyways. I was looking at outfront's short blocks, as well as LIC's, which are across the country, among several others.
It's tough to find a shop that will always do right by you. The ones that get high recommendations also tend to be super busy, which allows them to charge a premium and there's always a possibility that something doesn't get checked properly during the build with that high of a turnover. I guess you just have to do your due diligence in finding a reputable shop and roll the dice, which is a lot to swallow with how much building these engines costs.
Good luck with the build, looking forward to seeing how it turns out.
10-31-2015, 10:12 PM
#50
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I think in your position I'd be apt to put the stock Downpipe and intercooler back on and take advantage of the warranty.
I don't know your budget - but the engine in the Type-25 would be pretty damned tempting if I was doing a GR
Type 25 USA Web Site
I don't know your budget - but the engine in the Type-25 would be pretty damned tempting if I was doing a GR
Type 25 USA Web Site
11-02-2015, 03:51 PM
#52
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Got the failed piston back today... It's a strange one.
I've never seen piston damage quite like this before
Album below
Subaru 2.5 Melted Piston - Album on Imgur
It looks to me like the piston melted over time. Notice how the ring is melted into the lands in some spots. There's transfer of material from one skirt to the other.
Believe it or not, the bores didn't look bad. This was the only piston that looked bad
I've never seen piston damage quite like this before
Album below
Subaru 2.5 Melted Piston - Album on Imgur
It looks to me like the piston melted over time. Notice how the ring is melted into the lands in some spots. There's transfer of material from one skirt to the other.
Believe it or not, the bores didn't look bad. This was the only piston that looked bad
11-03-2015, 08:16 AM
#55
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Looks like #3 was running leaner for quite some time. Wow. Crazy looking.
Did you get the Outfront block back? What are your plans for the heads?
Did you get the Outfront block back? What are your plans for the heads?
11-03-2015, 08:20 PM
#56
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Block finally showed up yesterday it looks good, but it's hard to see from the outside. I had them redo my heads at the same time, so the motor came back as a longblock.
Nothing fancy on the head rebuild, just basic machining, stock springs, had them redo the AVCS setup at the same time.
To the credit of Outfront, it sounds like the bad piston transferred a lot of crap to the heads so it took a lot of time to clean them up. Still wish they'd been honest about the ship date... but like I said, every machine shop I've ever dealt with did stuff like that.
FYI - the consensus of my non-subaru engine guys is that there was probably a vacuum leak on the cylinder which caused a lean condition. Since the motor was tuned with a single O2, the rest of the cylinder probably got rich to compensate for the lean one.
Nothing fancy on the head rebuild, just basic machining, stock springs, had them redo the AVCS setup at the same time.
To the credit of Outfront, it sounds like the bad piston transferred a lot of crap to the heads so it took a lot of time to clean them up. Still wish they'd been honest about the ship date... but like I said, every machine shop I've ever dealt with did stuff like that.
FYI - the consensus of my non-subaru engine guys is that there was probably a vacuum leak on the cylinder which caused a lean condition. Since the motor was tuned with a single O2, the rest of the cylinder probably got rich to compensate for the lean one.
11-06-2015, 03:01 PM
#57
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Got more pics of the dead block today. Note the block is actually sitting upside down on the ground
(these are all thumbs)
Here's the actual bore of the bad piston.
The other holes look pretty good to me
(these are all thumbs)
Here's the actual bore of the bad piston.
The other holes look pretty good to me
11-10-2015, 07:08 PM
#59
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One of my other engine builder buddies - a Chevy dragster specialist had a theory about the carbon on the piston getting lit off, making a glow plug and causing pre-ignition. There is a lot of carbon on the other pistons... makes sense if the E85 started "cleaning" the pistons
Another theory from a pro-drag racer buddy is actually an ultra rich condition. The piston melted on the side and apparently lean conditions tend to blow holes through the middle of the piston face.
This is an example of a N20 motor that melted after a N20 line failed (which makes for an ULTRA rich condition) Looks pretty familiar
This is the same guy that had a motor go lean
For the record Bob is a pro, so going through motors is a fact of life. I think you guys can probably appreciate his Turbo/N20 drag motor
Had a aerospace metallurgist look at the burnt piston closer, the metal not only melted, but enough of it melted to puddle and run down the side. So it got hot as F@ck
Another theory from a pro-drag racer buddy is actually an ultra rich condition. The piston melted on the side and apparently lean conditions tend to blow holes through the middle of the piston face.
This is an example of a N20 motor that melted after a N20 line failed (which makes for an ULTRA rich condition) Looks pretty familiar
This is the same guy that had a motor go lean
For the record Bob is a pro, so going through motors is a fact of life. I think you guys can probably appreciate his Turbo/N20 drag motor
Had a aerospace metallurgist look at the burnt piston closer, the metal not only melted, but enough of it melted to puddle and run down the side. So it got hot as F@ck
Last edited by Lowend; 11-10-2015 at 07:20 PM.
11-11-2015, 10:42 AM
#60
One of my other engine builder buddies - a Chevy dragster specialist had a theory about the carbon on the piston getting lit off, making a glow plug and causing pre-ignition. There is a lot of carbon on the other pistons... makes sense if the E85 started "cleaning" the pistons
Another theory from a pro-drag racer buddy is actually an ultra rich condition. The piston melted on the side and apparently lean conditions tend to blow holes through the middle of the piston face.
This is an example of a N20 motor that melted after a N20 line failed (which makes for an ULTRA rich condition) Looks pretty familiar
This is the same guy that had a motor go lean
For the record Bob is a pro, so going through motors is a fact of life. I think you guys can probably appreciate his Turbo/N20 drag motor
Had a aerospace metallurgist look at the burnt piston closer, the metal not only melted, but enough of it melted to puddle and run down the side. So it got hot as F@ck
Another theory from a pro-drag racer buddy is actually an ultra rich condition. The piston melted on the side and apparently lean conditions tend to blow holes through the middle of the piston face.
This is an example of a N20 motor that melted after a N20 line failed (which makes for an ULTRA rich condition) Looks pretty familiar
This is the same guy that had a motor go lean
For the record Bob is a pro, so going through motors is a fact of life. I think you guys can probably appreciate his Turbo/N20 drag motor
Had a aerospace metallurgist look at the burnt piston closer, the metal not only melted, but enough of it melted to puddle and run down the side. So it got hot as F@ck
-- Ed