My point wasn't to point out who caused this tragedy, I was giving the folks, the everyday citizens some props for doing what they did, and that's the intention of this thread. Like if you did something like that, where you did what you had to do to help, this thread would read something like , "Props to slvrsubywagon for being a hero to his fellow citizens"

 

Point taken. But I think if I were to do something like that, as you pointed out, the number one object I would want taken care of, is the truth unfurled, especially if it was sealed with my blood. Wouldn't you agree? Don't you think those people on that plane would rather us figure out who caused this incident, so it does not happen again to future generations (their kids), rather than giving them props for being alittle heroic? My point being, I will not join in mourning with a government, with a people that uphold such government, in something that they themselves committed. And I will especially not back a government who invades foreign nations, under the presumption that that nation was the one that committed the deed, with no hard substance or proof. Frankly, I'm sick and fed up with this twin tower crap. Solve the first problem first (who), and then maybe mourning would be a little more meaningful afterwards. Because while you and everyone else is mourning, something that tragic is bound to happen again, because nobody cared to find out the "who," but instead cared more about giving props to the people that it happened to.

 

How would do you propose to solve your 1st point? I have no idea, nor do many of Americans with 100% certainty who caused this to happen. Neither of us can say oh it's the US, or oh it's the Al Qaeda with 100% certainty. But I'm sure not gonna wait for the answer to surface before I support our everyday citizens. It's sort of like , "Yeah I know you helped saved all these lives and risked your own Mr. Joe Citizen, but that's not important until we first find who caused this to happen. . . so we'll get back to your story in a few months, maybe years, maybe never." It wasn't "Joe Citizen's" fault and it doesn't mean there acts should be less noticed.

 

I'd be careful throwing statements around like you do, I am sure some people here lost loved ones in 9/11 and would get pretty angry about that. :/ But I understand where you're coming from.

 

So if your mother, father, friend or family member was murdered and the truth was never found out about who or why you would never morn them? You morn the lives lost not the who or why.

 

i didnt live through it either.

but i remember reading a magazine piece where they interviewed gen X and Gen Y'ers...

and more than half couldnt remember what that day was or when the pearl harbor event happened.

so i'm saying you dont have to live through it to remember it. a simple history class in high school would have or SHOULD have mentioned this date and hopefully made a dent in there somewhere...

 

I think we have moved on as a nation and a culture. Memorializing these things help us remember where we've been and where we should be headed.

Just think of what happened as a reality check. It sort puts things into perspective on a personal and a global level. Pearl Habor Day should be no different. Both events have provoked terrible wars that followed......

Be thankful for what you have in life because there's no guarantee it will always be around for you.

my $0.02

 

So what's your point? Just because I don't mourn with them doesn't mean I hate them. I think we've all lost loved ones in one way or another. I don't get butthurt if people don't come to my aid 5 years later. Some people need to get over it.



Yes I would mourn for them. I wouldn't ask the whole nation to, though, nor would I expect them to. They (everyone else) would make themselves useful by finding out who, if it was a true disaster. Point made?

 

That is my point.

 

And my point is, it's been 5 years. We're all dying, just at different rates. Don't expect everyone to be mourning just because someone you knew or loved, died (not meaning you specifically, Morgan). And don't get offended, that's all in the receivers self control.

 

Hrm, I think you guys are misunderstanding. I'm not trying to start anything or say that I don't care - the truth of the matter is that we're all optimists and pessimists. How you see an event is not how I see an event. Sure, it's very tragic, and yes, those that have given and have tried to help are honored, but I personally think of it as a time of turmoil and it doesn't bring up happy thoughts - hence my need to move on.

However, there are those that memorialize and see it in a positive way - as in, this didn't destroy our nation, but it brought us closer and we are more patriotic. That in itself, is great, but I don't want to be part of the celebration, because it does not have the same effect on me.

Don't get me wrong - I honor those that fight and have fought and those that will in the future. However, don't think that I'm on the otherside because of my own views. I think some people take this to the extreme, where they stand by the motto of: If you're not one of us, you're one of them. Not true, and not me.

People cope in different ways, accept it. There are those who mourn with others, and there are those who mourn by themselves and don't show it. I'm of the latter.

 

Nobody is "expecting" the country to pitty them.

Most people do it out of show of respect, others do it for personal resons (i.e. compassion, religious rerasons, personal loss, etc).

The only thing people should "expect" from you is a little coutesy, that's all.

 

Actually, they are infact expecting me to pity them. Look at all the posts here, yours included. You put it as courtesy, that's what you expect. Sympathy, pity, mourning, whatever you wanna call it. I'm not going to give someone courtesy on the subject if they did, infact, bring it upon themselves.

As I said earlier, sure, it's tragic, but grow up. It's been 5 years.

 

^^^ I'm with slvrsubywgn on this one.

 

You mean like arguing on the internet via a Subaru forum?