Raising the driving age17? GOOD OR BAD??
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Figure it out!
Originally posted by riptide2
Do you realize how ridiculous that sounds? Just out of curiosity, I mapped the distance from where I used to live to the aforementioned college -- it's 7.5 miles one way. That's on the freeway, probably further on the city streets. It would take one close to 3 hours to walk that distance. Remember, I'm talking about an evening class -- which means that if I had to walk for 6 hours just to get there and back, I'd probably get no homework done that day.
...
Do you realize how ridiculous that sounds? Just out of curiosity, I mapped the distance from where I used to live to the aforementioned college -- it's 7.5 miles one way. That's on the freeway, probably further on the city streets. It would take one close to 3 hours to walk that distance. Remember, I'm talking about an evening class -- which means that if I had to walk for 6 hours just to get there and back, I'd probably get no homework done that day.
...
It doesn't sound ridiculous at all. It sounds like you are from LA and just drive everywhere. You probably drive to your mail box at the end of the drive. Stop being lazy!
You has some alternatives, other then walking. How about Public Transportation, Car pool, or even a bike.
You don't see people in China b*tch'n cause they don't own a car, they bike everywhere.
I biked to work and back every day for 3 years. (That was 8 miles one way). It was faster then the bus and sometimes faster then driving.
Also think about this...
Not driving to work = save on wear and tear on your car
Not driving to work = lower insurance
Not driving to work = save money on gas
I hate to say this, but you sound like a whinner. Get off your butt and figure it out. Bikes, Public Transportation, Car Pool, walking, etc.
Sorry for being so harsh, but I just get worked up over whinners and complainers.
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i dont know about you guys but i didnt get any more responsible with my life or driving from age 16 to 17.. i dont think it would do anything but result in less drivers on the road, which i dont mind
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Originally posted by Sisqocqk
It's been done before! Do you honestly think cars have been around forever? Haven't you ever used those two extremities sticking out of your hips and used a bike or walked? Why do you think a lot of people in dense populations ride bikes or walk like in Tokyo, HK, Delhi and Mexico City? It's because driving would be almost impossible for most places and for countless reasons like traffic, pollution, time etc.
It's been done before! Do you honestly think cars have been around forever? Haven't you ever used those two extremities sticking out of your hips and used a bike or walked? Why do you think a lot of people in dense populations ride bikes or walk like in Tokyo, HK, Delhi and Mexico City? It's because driving would be almost impossible for most places and for countless reasons like traffic, pollution, time etc.
I used to walk everywhere at 10+ miles a day until finally purchasing a bicycle.
It's true that not all 16 yr olds are bad drivers. Of course you're going to have the cautious "10 & 2" drivers. Seems insurance companies think otherwise though when comparing the 16yr olds to the "more mature/experienced" drivers. You'd think they've actually done the math too which is why premiums are sky-high for a 16yr old, right?
Once again... nobody is perfect. It's not like you're a F1 driver on your 25th b-day. Insurance companies know this too which is why the rates are lower then the 16yr old rates. It's not rocket science buddy. Think about it... When you were 16yrs old in your POS $1000 car did you really have priorites when compared to you 25yr old adult life? Did you have to worry about rent, children, food, bills, etc. Probably not unless your were living on your own at 16 which i highly doubt.
When you're older ALL these little things pop into your thick brain and you start questioning yourself "maybe i should take it easy... i really can't afford a ticket or jepordize my health or saftey for the sake of my children". This mindset is what keeps you safer than the stupid 16yr old0 that simply doesn't give a **** and will rev his engine because he thinks he'll get laid sooner.
Eric
Seems insurance companies think otherwise though when comparing the 16yr olds to the "more mature/experienced" drivers. You'd think they've actually done the math too which is why premiums are sky-high for a 16yr old, right? Once again... nobody is perfect. It's not like you're a F1 driver on your 25th b-day. Insurance companies know this too which is why the rates are lower then the 16yr old rates. It's not rocket science buddy. Think about it... When you were 16yrs old in your POS $1000 car did you really have priorites when compared to you 25yr old adult life? Did you have to worry about rent, children, food, bills, etc. Probably not unless your were living on your own at 16 which i highly doubt.
When you're older ALL these little things pop into your thick brain and you start questioning yourself "maybe i should take it easy... i really can't afford a ticket or jepordize my health or saftey for the sake of my children". This mindset is what keeps you safer than the stupid 16yr old0 that simply doesn't give a **** and will rev his engine because he thinks he'll get laid sooner.
Eric
Once again, just because you were 16 once, that doesn't mean that you know how every single 16-year old thinks. Not all 16-year olds "rev their engines and think they'll get laid sooner" -- some of them actually choose to do productive things with their lives -- not unlike you and I. A car makes it easier for the said 16-year olds (and for you and I) to do those things.
The reason insurance is so high for the 16-year olds is because a vast majority of them are inexperienced drivers! So they do get into more accidents, but not because they are 16 but because they are inexperienced. Ok, here's an extension of your logic: insurance is higher for fast cars, fast cars get into more accidents, let's ban fast cars. Right?
Personally, I was a more cautious driver when I was 16 than I am now (less experienced, yes, but more cautious.) I knew that both my family and I will be in a lot of trouble if I crashed the family car. At least today if I crash, I will be the only one getting screwed, since I have my own car and my own insurance. But that's just me.
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Re: Figure it out!
Originally posted by Lionfish42
It doesn't sound ridiculous at all. It sounds like you are from LA and just drive everywhere. You probably drive to your mail box at the end of the drive. Stop being lazy!
You has some alternatives, other then walking. How about Public Transportation, Car pool, or even a bike.
You don't see people in China b*tch'n cause they don't own a car, they bike everywhere.
I biked to work and back every day for 3 years. (That was 8 miles one way). It was faster then the bus and sometimes faster then driving.
Also think about this...
Not driving to work = save on wear and tear on your car
Not driving to work = lower insurance
Not driving to work = save money on gas
I hate to say this, but you sound like a whinner. Get off your butt and figure it out. Bikes, Public Transportation, Car Pool, walking, etc.
Sorry for being so harsh, but I just get worked up over whinners and complainers.
It doesn't sound ridiculous at all. It sounds like you are from LA and just drive everywhere. You probably drive to your mail box at the end of the drive. Stop being lazy!
You has some alternatives, other then walking. How about Public Transportation, Car pool, or even a bike.
You don't see people in China b*tch'n cause they don't own a car, they bike everywhere.
I biked to work and back every day for 3 years. (That was 8 miles one way). It was faster then the bus and sometimes faster then driving.
Also think about this...
Not driving to work = save on wear and tear on your car
Not driving to work = lower insurance
Not driving to work = save money on gas
I hate to say this, but you sound like a whinner. Get off your butt and figure it out. Bikes, Public Transportation, Car Pool, walking, etc.
Sorry for being so harsh, but I just get worked up over whinners and complainers.
Uh huh. So, being such a non-whiner that you are, why do you own a car? How about practicing some of what you're preaching?
(I wouldn't even get into the fact that the car that you own consumes a lot of gas and commands fairly high insurance rates.)
QUOTE]Originally posted by dorifto88
i firmly believe certain ages should only be able to drive certain cars.
16-17 - Saturn
18-40 - whatever the hell you can afford
41-50 -slow *** luxury sedan
51- infiniti - hire a taxi driver [/QUOTE]
16-17 Saturn, Yep I had that and that is why I have a messed up back now. That car crumbled (and not in the good way) when I got hit, not my fault I got hit, but I paid a huge price for being in a POS car. To this day I still have many problems with my back and I will not go near a Saturn again. When I was in the WRX accident I was mush closer to the point of impact, T-boned my side, and I walked away FINE, little sore in the back or one day but I didn’t hurt it again.
When my parents got me a car they would not buy a lot of things because they were to worried I would get hurt again and wanted to make sure I was in a bigger car then a Saturn and one that wasn’t as a death trap.
Oh and I really believe that no matter what age you change the driving age too the rate of accidents will just change with it. The first 2 years of driving will be the most accidents, regardless if it is age 16 or 18 or even 20, it is all about learning something new and trying to figure out what it is about. Everyone will want to play with a new toy when they get it.
i firmly believe certain ages should only be able to drive certain cars.
16-17 - Saturn
18-40 - whatever the hell you can afford
41-50 -slow *** luxury sedan
51- infiniti - hire a taxi driver [/QUOTE]
16-17 Saturn, Yep I had that and that is why I have a messed up back now. That car crumbled (and not in the good way) when I got hit, not my fault I got hit, but I paid a huge price for being in a POS car. To this day I still have many problems with my back and I will not go near a Saturn again. When I was in the WRX accident I was mush closer to the point of impact, T-boned my side, and I walked away FINE, little sore in the back or one day but I didn’t hurt it again.
When my parents got me a car they would not buy a lot of things because they were to worried I would get hurt again and wanted to make sure I was in a bigger car then a Saturn and one that wasn’t as a death trap.
Oh and I really believe that no matter what age you change the driving age too the rate of accidents will just change with it. The first 2 years of driving will be the most accidents, regardless if it is age 16 or 18 or even 20, it is all about learning something new and trying to figure out what it is about. Everyone will want to play with a new toy when they get it.
[Oh and in big cities like SF I think it is very easy to say take a bus or walk. I think things are closer to were you need to be. In some of the suburbs of Sacramento you don’t have a way to get around, if you lived in Folsom (up until about a year ago, and there was only one twice a day) there was no way to take a city bus outside of Folsom, and there wasn’t much in Folsom. If you needed to go to college you were screwed if it wasn’t one of the 10 classes offered in the trailers. Living in Orangeville and the bottom of Fair Oaks also made it hard to get a bus, there just wasn’t that many that came out there and it would take forever to get anywhere near the Light Rail to get downtown. My high school was over 10 miles away on a street that wasn’t that safe to walk on, less then a foot between the right lane and a 4 foot ditch, plus the speed limit was 50 mph and people don’t care about walkers.
I would be all for not having as many young drivers but there needs to be a away for them to get around. In a lot of places there is just not a good way for them to do it. They need a car.
I would be all for not having as many young drivers but there needs to be a away for them to get around. In a lot of places there is just not a good way for them to do it. They need a car.
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Originally posted by riptide2
[B]Um, well, things like antibiotics and toilet paper haven't been around forever either... If you need to use either of those today, do you? (Even though you don't REALLY have to...)
[B]
Good for you. So, how come you have a car now?
Once again, just because you were 16 once, that doesn't mean that you know how every single 16-year old thinks. Not all 16-year olds "rev their engines and think they'll get laid sooner" -- some of them actually choose to do productive things with their lives -- not unlike you and I. A car makes it easier for the said 16-year olds (and for you and I) to do those things.
The reason insurance is so high for the 16-year olds is because a vast majority of them are inexperienced drivers! So they do get into more accidents, but not because they are 16 but because they are inexperienced. Ok, here's an extension of your logic: insurance is higher for fast cars, fast cars get into more accidents, let's ban fast cars. Right?
Personally, I was a more cautious driver when I was 16 than I am now (less experienced, yes, but more cautious.) I knew that both my family and I will be in a lot of trouble if I crashed the family car. At least today if I crash, I will be the only one getting screwed, since I have my own car and my own insurance. But that's just me.
[B]Um, well, things like antibiotics and toilet paper haven't been around forever either... If you need to use either of those today, do you? (Even though you don't REALLY have to...)
[B]
Good for you. So, how come you have a car now?
Once again, just because you were 16 once, that doesn't mean that you know how every single 16-year old thinks. Not all 16-year olds "rev their engines and think they'll get laid sooner" -- some of them actually choose to do productive things with their lives -- not unlike you and I. A car makes it easier for the said 16-year olds (and for you and I) to do those things.
The reason insurance is so high for the 16-year olds is because a vast majority of them are inexperienced drivers! So they do get into more accidents, but not because they are 16 but because they are inexperienced. Ok, here's an extension of your logic: insurance is higher for fast cars, fast cars get into more accidents, let's ban fast cars. Right?
Personally, I was a more cautious driver when I was 16 than I am now (less experienced, yes, but more cautious.) I knew that both my family and I will be in a lot of trouble if I crashed the family car. At least today if I crash, I will be the only one getting screwed, since I have my own car and my own insurance. But that's just me.
Ok you're obviously missing the entire point. BTW who are you trying to protect that's 16? Yes ALL 16yr olds are idiots. I haven't met one that wasn't. And i wipe with the left hand and eat with my right, are you happy dickface?
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Re: Re: Figure it out!
Originally posted by riptide2
Uh huh. So, being such a non-whiner that you are, why do you own a car? How about practicing some of what you're preaching?
(I wouldn't even get into the fact that the car that you own consumes a lot of gas and commands fairly high insurance rates.)
Uh huh. So, being such a non-whiner that you are, why do you own a car? How about practicing some of what you're preaching?
(I wouldn't even get into the fact that the car that you own consumes a lot of gas and commands fairly high insurance rates.)
While not denying that I have been and will be a hypocrite on several issues. I am far from a whiner.
However, just to keep my foot out of my mouth, my wife and I have a MUNI pass and use public transportation for work. We walk to the store to shop. And ride our bikes frequently (wife less frequently since she is pregnant).
To further inform you as to me owning a car. We put less then 10k miles on per year. Drive on the weekends and for vacation.
We have both lived in the city for 10 years with out ANY car and only rented them for weekend trips.
The only REASON that we decided to purchase a car, since we lived quite easily without one, is that my wife is expecting a child and we are going to be moving.
Of course, being the bright guy that I am, we purchased a WRX.
Hopefully that fore fills your inquiry
Last edited by Lionfish42; Feb 18, 2004 at 06:35 PM.
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Originally posted by Sisqocqk
Ok you're obviously missing the entire point. BTW who are you trying to protect that's 16? Yes ALL 16yr olds are idiots. I haven't met one that wasn't. And i wipe with the left hand and eat with my right, are you happy dickface?
Ok you're obviously missing the entire point. BTW who are you trying to protect that's 16? Yes ALL 16yr olds are idiots. I haven't met one that wasn't. And i wipe with the left hand and eat with my right, are you happy dickface?
Again, you're judging every 16-year old by your own standards. From your posts it is also apparent that your level of intelligence has not improved since you were 16. Congratulations, and eat a fat one.
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Re: Re: Re: Figure it out!
Originally posted by Lionfish42
While not denying that I have and will be a hypocrite on several issues. I am far from a whiner.
However, just to keep my foot out of my mouth, my wife and I have a MUNI pass and use public transportation for work. We walk to the store to shop. And ride our bikes frequently (wife less frequently since she is pregnant).
To further inform you as to me owning a car. We put less then 10k miles on per year. Drive on the weekends and for vacation.
We have both lived in the city for 10 years with out ANY car and only rented them for weekend trips.
The only REASON that we decided to purchase a car, since we lived quite easily without one, is that my wife is expecting a child and we are going to be moving.
Of course, being the bright guy that I am, we purchased a WRX.
Hopefully that fore fills your inquiry
While not denying that I have and will be a hypocrite on several issues. I am far from a whiner.
However, just to keep my foot out of my mouth, my wife and I have a MUNI pass and use public transportation for work. We walk to the store to shop. And ride our bikes frequently (wife less frequently since she is pregnant).
To further inform you as to me owning a car. We put less then 10k miles on per year. Drive on the weekends and for vacation.
We have both lived in the city for 10 years with out ANY car and only rented them for weekend trips.
The only REASON that we decided to purchase a car, since we lived quite easily without one, is that my wife is expecting a child and we are going to be moving.
Of course, being the bright guy that I am, we purchased a WRX.
Hopefully that fore fills your inquiry
Yes, it does. I never called you a whiner. I merely wanted to point out the hypocritical nature of your posting (and you seem to agree with me here.)
I think that you will find that, as you move out of the city (I'm assuming that you're moving to the suburbs), your attitude towards car ownership will change.
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Originally posted by riptide2
Again, you're judging every 16-year old by your own standards. From your posts it is also apparent that your level of intelligence has not improved since you were 16. Congratulations, and eat a fat one.
Again, you're judging every 16-year old by your own standards. From your posts it is also apparent that your level of intelligence has not improved since you were 16. Congratulations, and eat a fat one.
Parents notes from USAA
US statistics for the 16 year old driver:
Motor vehicle death rates per 100,000 people peaked at age 16 for drivers and passengers.
About two out of every three teenagers killed in crashes were males.
*this proves my immature "wanting to get laid" theory
Male teenage (typically age 16) drivers have higher death rates than their female counterparts-21 per 100,000 people, compared to 10 per 100,000 for females.
*Wow another piece of evidence for ya a$$hole!
53% of all teenage motor vehicle deaths occur on weekends (Fri.-Sun.). 41% of all teenage motor vehicle deaths occur between 9 p.m. and 6 a.m.
*Hmm... maybe they were showing off on the weekends? i could be wrong though...
65% of teenage passenger vehicle occupant deaths were drivers and 45% were passengers.
*Never saw that one coming... i must live in a bubble
62% of teenage passenger deaths occurred in crashes in which a sixteen year old was driving. Among people of all ages, 20% of passenger deaths in 1998 occurred when a teenager was driving
The list goes on and on....
Don't be mad at me because you're too damn lazy.
Eric
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Figure it out!
Originally posted by riptide2
Yes, it does. I never called you a whiner. I merely wanted to point out the hypocritical nature of your posting (and you seem to agree with me here.)
I think that you will find that, as you move out of the city (I'm assuming that you're moving to the suburbs), your attitude towards car ownership will change.
Yes, it does. I never called you a whiner. I merely wanted to point out the hypocritical nature of your posting (and you seem to agree with me here.)
I think that you will find that, as you move out of the city (I'm assuming that you're moving to the suburbs), your attitude towards car ownership will change.
However, we are moving to Marin. Where I have lived before and a car is important, I will agree. However, I did commute from there as well using the Ferry or Golden Gate Transit. And we both will continue to use public transportation when available.
What disturbs me is people being so dependant on cars that they FEEL there is no other option. I can’t get to school, waaaa! I can’t get to work, waaa! I can’t….I can’t….I can’t….Sounds like Veruca Salt (Wonka reference). All I want to say is “Shut your hole and Cowboy the F*** Up!”
I guess (not to ramble on further, but I will) my issue is not the dependency on cars (while that is an issue) it is more about the DEPENDANCY. They need to be weaned off the nipple and get on with it.
As to your other quote about the gas and insurance. I could of bought the STI (more gas and insurance) or worse yet a massive 4wd SUV!
On that note...I saw a massive SUV yesterday with the bumper sticker that said "No War for Oil!" Give me a break! People like that are Republicans and don't even know it. The Democrat sh*t pours from there mouth, but then they drive SUVs, b*tch about Taxes, b*tch about protection, talk about buying this and that. Whatever!