FUNKED1

"Most people think the government is wrong when they're party of choice isn't the one calling the shots."
Yep, so true.

dr3d1zzl3

iTrader: (1)

cept kim is a bit smartar then bush, oh and shorter to, they are both ugly as sin tho

mmboost

iTrader: (2)

I think you've missed the point. We're not arguing something like the plot of Trading Places (whether or not you can take an honest civilized man and make a theiving low life out of him and visa verse). The point is, choosing to kill in the first place. People who go to war and are against it and get wrapped up in the violence because they are in the midst of it, that's no surprise. Its an unfortunate part of human instinct. But that is differen't than reasoning why we should not be killing in the first place. You should not confuse instinct with reason.... nor should you substitute one for the other. That's the whole point of this democracy and foreign policy thingy we do. Our instinct is to kill. Our reason gives us the ability to have compassion. Our spirituality enables us to trust in Something greater than us when we realize we are not capable of compassion, hopefully causing us to realize it is possible to be compassionate despite our fears.

Although I am a complete pacifist, I cannot deny that when punched my blood does not boil and my first reaction would be to punch back... extrapolate to being in combat. But after the fact, I would be sorely disappointed with myself (understatement). My goals is to truly have a pacifist demeanor when it comes to violence. Fortunately, on the physical level I haven't had much of a chance to test it out since highschool And in my endeavour to be a pacifist I believe any sort of offense is wrong.

Going to Afghanistan and Iraq were not defensive measures. We have been duped into believing that, seriously. In football do you see defensive linemen running across the line of scrimmage grabbing offensive teammembers and throwing them to the ground? No, of course not, they'd get penalized. Its a great example of defense. They are only allowed to do what is necessary on their home turf. Defending ourselves again Iraq, Iran, North Korea, etc , a small part of it, is to be more careful about people and packages that come into our country. But the best way we can defend ourselves? Is to allow ourselves to be taken advantage of. Yep, that's right. We are so wealthy, care for the poor of the world who will never pay us back. Not so that it makes people indebted to us, but so that we truly become part of the greater world that we live in. We have all the resources, most countries have little to none compared to us. Instead of forcing our politics on them, why not be a part of their planet? The only thing that stops us from that is fear.

jason

dr3d1zzl3

iTrader: (1)

you know what nuke everything, and if anything moves after that nuke it to.

This world sucks and everyone on it is an *******.

FUNKED1

It's the only way to be sure.

odyss3y

iTrader: (1)

the link that will solve the debate

verc

iTrader: (12)

I didn't even bother to read half the jack crap on this thread since 90 percent of all people on the internet period are uneducated biased incapable-of-critical-thinking-nor-looking-from-a-holistic-perspective , and because I know what Sisqocqk's opinions are on this board and I will stand by whatever he says until the cows come home (or I disagree with him).


I'm not even going to start arguing right now b/c I didn't read any of this, nor do I have time to reply anymore since I am very busy at the moment. All I'm saying is if you have the chance to go take or audit a higher level history course at a top tier university go do it so the conservatives will 0wn you. Period. In fact, in a truly academic, intellectual setting where purely factual and logical arguements are being exchanged, I have never seen liberals hold their own against conservatives on the subject of war and foreign policy (unless they go back to their immature tree-hugging arguements kind of like little kids do on the playground when they get cornered). I mean, period. I knew this tree-hugging liberal girl who wanted to do political science and she was 0wn3d so much she flipped out and tried to burn down our dorm because she thought universities were evil and imprisoning our thought (I mean wtf...a university is the friggin' bastion of independent thought) and got expelled.

dr3d1zzl3

iTrader: (1)

Did you miss the post when he said that you and him were gay lovers who were estranged due to an unfortunate accident with a can of coolwhip?

SO your saying that you stand by him even thru all of that?



(this is a joke for those who dont understand funnay)

dr3d1zzl3

iTrader: (1)

Dont be lulled into the sense that ALL Universities are bastions of free thought. Its the professors who are not hte university.

verc

iTrader: (12)

o man you are friggin' brilliant. Did you honestly think that all of us were led to believe that going into Afghanistan and Iraq were 'defensive measures'? No ish, that's only to lead the masses of ignorant people into supporting the war and that's not why educated and free-thinking people should support the war. The main liberal arguement is that we should somehow make friends with everyone and collectively move towards world peace. What the hell is peace anyways? A human body at peace is cold stone dead, the best it can do is equillibrium. And this is where we are headed right now, mainly, the US is NOT a unilateral entity as many liberal scholars would have you believe, nor does the US have hegemony over the entire foreign world as liberal scholars will want you to believe. There has not been one time, nor will there ever be in history where the world liberal scholars strive to attain will ever exist. Why? Because there are discrepancies in interests which every liberal scholar ABSOLUTELY FAILS to take into account. This is why the euro is such a failure of a currency. This is why Britain was pretty smart not to join in on the Euro. In a collective organization, certain entities gain, others have to lose, and the ones that gain are usually there in the first place to eliminate or shorten their disparity with the leading powers.

dr3d1zzl3

iTrader: (1)

can you please expalin to me how the euro is a "complete failure".

i would love to hear this...

psoper

no kidding, last I checked it was pushing $1.30 US.

Our dollar is quickly going to be even with canadian or australian dollars at the rate we're going.

mmboost

iTrader: (2)

Go and enjoy your leadership that doesn't care about what people want, but as you admit, lies to get their way... "That's only to lead the masses of ignorant people into supporting the war" At least your man enough to admit that the government you support wants to utterly evade any hint of democracy. The point is not to preserve the USA. The point is to preserve democracy in the USA. If you don't want any sort of say in what your government does, then move to North Korea, or Iraq, or Syria. Liberal or conservative, saying that its OK for the American government to lie and dupe its citizens to forward its own private agenda is probably the stupidest political argument I've heard. You are a friggin' idiot. I mean really stupid to the Nth degree. What the **** are you trying to preserve?

jason

dr3d1zzl3

iTrader: (1)

i just want to make sure that my cup o noodles doesnt burn.

MonkeyAB

iTrader: (1)

The Geneva Convention is the basis for our initiation of this war. I believe, and feel free to chime in here, that it has guidelines on the possesion of weapons of mass destruction. The law of armed conflict was written for a reason. I could go on and on here, but I'll just add one more thing, your "President" whom you follow so blindly with the utmost contempt for the Constitution of the United States of America, which you swore to protect, has also never been in a "war environment".

I leave you now with the words of a man wiser than you or I...

"Injustice anywhere is a threat to justice everywhere."

"Like an unchecked cancer, hate corrodes the personality and eats away its vital unity. Hate destroys a man's sense of values and his objectivity. It causes him to describe the beautiful as ugly and the ugly as beautiful, and to confuse the true with the false and the false with the true."

"Nonviolence is the answer to the crucial political and moral questions of our time; the need for mankind to overcome oppression and violence without resorting to oppression and violence. Mankind must evolve for all human conflict a method which rejects revenge, aggression, and retaliation. The foundation of such a method is love." -- Martin Luther King Jr.

Alex