The Real Abuse at Guantanamo
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The media, regardless of it's slant, has only negative news even about things within our country. That's how the news operates. You guys saying that the news only shows things bad about the war is like saying the sky is blue. If all I hear on the local news is about shootings, pit bull maulings, and anarchy riots, why the f*** would I expect to hear good things about the war in Iraq. "Correct" slant my ***...
And about due process, I'm not saying we have to have a people's court going on at Gitmo, shotgunning cases through with a turnover of a few days for each prisoner. But we should at least charge these people with crimes and tell them that, when we have time, they'll get a chance to voice their side and have a day in court (even if everyone knows their side is bs and they'll be convicted). I agree that these are pretty open and shut cases, we caught these guys in the act of attacking the US or US troops. But even when someone is caught with blood on their hands (so we know they are criminals), they still get charged and then brought to court. All I'm saying is that it can't hurt to extend to our enemies the same rights that we fight for. It may seem 'soft' but really it's just great PR (which, as you point out, the military could use some help on right now).
And about due process, I'm not saying we have to have a people's court going on at Gitmo, shotgunning cases through with a turnover of a few days for each prisoner. But we should at least charge these people with crimes and tell them that, when we have time, they'll get a chance to voice their side and have a day in court (even if everyone knows their side is bs and they'll be convicted). I agree that these are pretty open and shut cases, we caught these guys in the act of attacking the US or US troops. But even when someone is caught with blood on their hands (so we know they are criminals), they still get charged and then brought to court. All I'm saying is that it can't hurt to extend to our enemies the same rights that we fight for. It may seem 'soft' but really it's just great PR (which, as you point out, the military could use some help on right now).
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Originally Posted by MVWRX
Hahaha, no I didn't mean anything bad about the soldiers who are at GITMO. What I meant is that at this point in time we have two 'acounts' of what goes on there. One is from the 'yellow press' and is almost definatly with a liberal lean. The other is from this ex-Colonel and is almost definatly with a conservative lean.
Either way, my personal statement was that regardless of what's going on there, all guards at all prisons in the US (or controlled by the US) should be held to a standard of perfection with respect to their treatment of prisoners, also regardless of what is required by international law and also regardless of how the prisoners are acting. That way our guards won't be run through the media ringer, there won't be any inciting of riots or terrorism, and we can all be proud that we hold our selves to higher standards than the countries/regimes we oppose because it's the right thing to do and not just because some conventions tell us we should. Oaf points out that we hear more about our mistreating of prisoners than about our enemies mistreating prisoners. Holding our guards to a perfect standard (absolutely no mistreatment of any prisoner at any time, regardless of an individual prisoners bad behavior) would also shift the attention from the prisoners we keep to the attrocities being commited by our enemies.
Not to mention that we are fighting oversees to ensure our freedoms and rights, one of which is the right to due process. If we deny these prisoners the very rights we are fighting for, even if they deserve no rights at all, we are telling the world and ourselves that we think some people are not worth the freedoms and rights this country offers. Not very American if you ask me.
Either way, my personal statement was that regardless of what's going on there, all guards at all prisons in the US (or controlled by the US) should be held to a standard of perfection with respect to their treatment of prisoners, also regardless of what is required by international law and also regardless of how the prisoners are acting. That way our guards won't be run through the media ringer, there won't be any inciting of riots or terrorism, and we can all be proud that we hold our selves to higher standards than the countries/regimes we oppose because it's the right thing to do and not just because some conventions tell us we should. Oaf points out that we hear more about our mistreating of prisoners than about our enemies mistreating prisoners. Holding our guards to a perfect standard (absolutely no mistreatment of any prisoner at any time, regardless of an individual prisoners bad behavior) would also shift the attention from the prisoners we keep to the attrocities being commited by our enemies.
Not to mention that we are fighting oversees to ensure our freedoms and rights, one of which is the right to due process. If we deny these prisoners the very rights we are fighting for, even if they deserve no rights at all, we are telling the world and ourselves that we think some people are not worth the freedoms and rights this country offers. Not very American if you ask me.
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Originally Posted by MVWRX
The media, regardless of it's slant, has only negative news even about things within our country. That's how the news operates. You guys saying that the news only shows things bad about the war is like saying the sky is blue. If all I hear on the local news is about shootings, pit bull maulings, and anarchy riots, why the f*** would I expect to hear good things about the war in Iraq. "Correct" slant my ***...
Of course I would like to hear more about how Iraqi children are now back in school with the help of our soldiers and how many Iraqi's have been saved by gallant acts of US servicemembers, just like I would like to hear about a new park that opened up in Detroit last week and how no-one was shot at the freedom festival this year.
Instead all I hear about is how 3 men were killed in a drive by and a little girl got gunned down playing in the front yard of her house by stray bullets, or Abu Gahrib this Abu Gahrib that.....
It's always negative, but if you think the US reports on the news at Gitmo and Iraq negatively you should see how the world press views us and portrays us regarding the issue. It just makes us look bad which is frustrating because we do so many good things for so many countries and people.
MVWRX said it best:
Originally Posted by MVWRX
And about due process, I'm not saying we have to have a people's court going on at Gitmo, shotgunning cases through with a turnover of a few days for each prisoner. But we should at least charge these people with crimes and tell them that, when we have time, they'll get a chance to voice their side and have a day in court (even if everyone knows their side is bs and they'll be convicted). I agree that these are pretty open and shut cases, we caught these guys in the act of attacking the US or US troops. But even when someone is caught with blood on their hands (so we know they are criminals), they still get charged and then brought to court. All I'm saying is that it can't hurt to extend to our enemies the same rights that we fight for. It may seem 'soft' but really it's just great PR (which, as you point out, the military could use some help on right now).
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