Jan 14th - Rally for Justice for Oscar Grant
01-13-2009, 08:48 AM
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Seriously, the officer is only exercising his rights. Right now he has the right to remain silent. The internal investigation is going to continue and when it's completed the officer will have to face the music. This lynch mob mentality pisses me off. It's just a reminder of how many violent people walk the streets freely among us looking for an excuse to cause harm.
I feel what you are saying. I too was there and I saw the same things. However, I know why I was there and I know what for. You'll always have people who just show up to go dumb.
About the OPD, well you gotta look at it this way. I aint sure where you are from Oakland but a lot of people within Oakland have been dealing with several issues from the OPD. There are still a lot of "unsettled" matters which the OPD was involved with. Naturally when you have such an incident, like Oscar's, these people come out to vocalize as well.
If you remember during the protest there were several speakers who had thier kids die in similar nature. So ofcorse you'll see annamosity towards OPD. Top that with another person being wrongfully killed, you got yourself some really upset people!
I support the protest, I support my community (oakland), and I as a black man understand what frustrations are out there. Not to say being black gives me anything different. I however do not support seeing others destory my community, property, and turning a protest in to a playground to **** on.
I only hope this time people well respect whats behind this protest. However, I am sure somethings will pop off.
About the OPD, well you gotta look at it this way. I aint sure where you are from Oakland but a lot of people within Oakland have been dealing with several issues from the OPD. There are still a lot of "unsettled" matters which the OPD was involved with. Naturally when you have such an incident, like Oscar's, these people come out to vocalize as well.
If you remember during the protest there were several speakers who had thier kids die in similar nature. So ofcorse you'll see annamosity towards OPD. Top that with another person being wrongfully killed, you got yourself some really upset people!
I support the protest, I support my community (oakland), and I as a black man understand what frustrations are out there. Not to say being black gives me anything different. I however do not support seeing others destory my community, property, and turning a protest in to a playground to **** on.
I only hope this time people well respect whats behind this protest. However, I am sure somethings will pop off.
I think that about covers it...... like I said, this aint nothing new just happened to be caught on video tape. This type of thing has been happening in my community for a looooooooong time.
01-13-2009, 08:54 AM
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Seriously, the officer is only exercising his rights. Right now he has the right to remain silent. The internal investigation is going to continue and when it's completed the officer will have to face the music. This lynch mob mentality pisses me off. It's just a reminder of how many violent people walk the streets freely among us looking for an excuse to cause harm.
01-13-2009, 08:59 AM
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I love how we "protesters" are labeled Lynch Mob.
LOL I wasnt breaking windows, burning cars, and going dumb... Neither were 90% of the people at the protest.
So don't let a few people ruin your vision of us protesting this tragedy!
LOL I wasnt breaking windows, burning cars, and going dumb... Neither were 90% of the people at the protest.
So don't let a few people ruin your vision of us protesting this tragedy!
01-13-2009, 09:14 AM
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What would you like to see happen that hasn't already happened? He is being investigated, and as already mentioned, exercising his right to remain silent. Last night, riots protesting the same thing in San Francisco ended up with people acting stupid. Is now the right time to protest anyways? Why not wait to see what happens? If the end result is unjust, then protest. I am not saying this is true about you KOSTI, but a lot of people are just using these protests as an excuse to act like children.
01-13-2009, 11:24 AM
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What would you like to see happen that hasn't already happened? He is being investigated, and as already mentioned, exercising his right to remain silent. Last night, riots protesting the same thing in San Francisco ended up with people acting stupid. Is now the right time to protest anyways? Why not wait to see what happens? If the end result is unjust, then protest. I am not saying this is true about you KOSTI, but a lot of people are just using these protests as an excuse to act like children.
I am actually happy with what has been going on in the last few days. I personally find nothing wrong with gathering as a community and vocalizing our thoughts together. We are all waiting to see what happens next and I understand things take time to pan out.
In addition this incident basically opened up the wounds of my community. There has been A LOT of "wrongful deaths" by police officers in Oakland over the last few decades. A lot of those have never been dealt justice and to see this happen again, it stirs the pot. So no, we are not just vocalizing anger for Oscar. We are vocalizing anger for the several other deaths that have occurred within the Oakland Community. Aside from that, as a community Oakland needs a lot of help. I don't have to tell you that, you know it. So these gatherings are also touching up on this.
And no, I am not the person burning cars, breaking windows, and acting dumb.
01-13-2009, 08:56 PM
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I am actually happy with what has been going on in the last few days. I personally find nothing wrong with gathering as a community and vocalizing our thoughts together. We are all waiting to see what happens next and I understand things take time to pan out.
In addition this incident basically opened up the wounds of my community. There has been A LOT of "wrongful deaths" by police officers in Oakland over the last few decades. A lot of those have never been dealt justice and to see this happen again, it stirs the pot. So no, we are not just vocalizing anger for Oscar. We are vocalizing anger for the several other deaths that have occurred within the Oakland Community. Aside from that, as a community Oakland needs a lot of help. I don't have to tell you that, you know it. So these gatherings are also touching up on this.
And no, I am not the person burning cars, breaking windows, and acting dumb.
In addition this incident basically opened up the wounds of my community. There has been A LOT of "wrongful deaths" by police officers in Oakland over the last few decades. A lot of those have never been dealt justice and to see this happen again, it stirs the pot. So no, we are not just vocalizing anger for Oscar. We are vocalizing anger for the several other deaths that have occurred within the Oakland Community. Aside from that, as a community Oakland needs a lot of help. I don't have to tell you that, you know it. So these gatherings are also touching up on this.
And no, I am not the person burning cars, breaking windows, and acting dumb.
id love for you to name 5 wrongful deaths. go ahead.
01-14-2009, 08:20 AM
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Ok smart ***:
Jose Luis Buenrostro - 15 year old killed unarmed walking back from the corner store.
Jerrold Cornelius Hall - Shot in the back with a shotgun because he "fit the description" of someone who stole a $60 walkman, oh yes, he was unarmed.
Bruce Seward - Shot by Bart Police after being found passed out in a dumpster; that means he is worthy of being shot and killed since he was unarmed and passed out in a dumpster.... yeah... and naked... yeah he was naked.
Mack Woodfox III - Shot by a cop at fruitvale, was unarmed as the officer claims he was reaching for a weapon, No weapon found.
Andrew Moppin - THE SAME OFFICER who shot and kill Mack, killed Andrew Moppin in a similar incident, "he was reaching for a gun". No weapon found on Andrew.
Should I name more? Because I have more........
Last edited by KOSTI; 01-14-2009 at 08:39 AM.
01-14-2009, 08:39 AM
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Anyone curious as to what really happened or are you perfectly happy to go off what some crappy phone video shows? We trust our LEO's to make life and death decisions to uphold the law and we give them the ability to take lives if need be to protect the innocent. The unfortunate thing is when you deal in life and death any mistakes made can be deadly. I really feel for the victims family but I also feel for the officer and his family FOR THE TIME BEING. Until I know what his intentions were and the circumstances I am more than happy to let the justice system take its course.
01-14-2009, 08:52 AM
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Ok smart ***:
Jose Luis Buenrostro - 15 year old killed unarmed walking back from the corner store.
Jerrold Cornelius Hall - Shot in the back with a shotgun because he "fit the description" of someone who stole a $60 walkman, oh yes, he was unarmed.
Bruce Seward - Shot by Bart Police after being found passed out in a dumpster; that means he is worthy of being shot and killed since he was unarmed and passed out in a dumpster.... yeah... and naked... yeah he was naked.
Mack Woodfox III - Shot by a cop at fruitvale, was unarmed as the officer claims he was reaching for a weapon, No weapon found.
Andrew Moppin - THE SAME OFFICER who shot and kill Mack, killed Andrew Moppin in a similar incident, "he was reaching for a gun". No weapon found on Andrew.
Should I name more? Because I have more........
Jose Luis Buenrostro - 15 year old killed unarmed walking back from the corner store.
Jerrold Cornelius Hall - Shot in the back with a shotgun because he "fit the description" of someone who stole a $60 walkman, oh yes, he was unarmed.
Bruce Seward - Shot by Bart Police after being found passed out in a dumpster; that means he is worthy of being shot and killed since he was unarmed and passed out in a dumpster.... yeah... and naked... yeah he was naked.
Mack Woodfox III - Shot by a cop at fruitvale, was unarmed as the officer claims he was reaching for a weapon, No weapon found.
Andrew Moppin - THE SAME OFFICER who shot and kill Mack, killed Andrew Moppin in a similar incident, "he was reaching for a gun". No weapon found on Andrew.
Should I name more? Because I have more........
Observation: When cops have you at gun point, don't make sudden moves.
Police confirmed Moppin had a $411 warrant out for his arrest for evading a BART fare. He also was on probation for possession of marijuana for sale, according to court records....
...Two officers not involved in the car stop found him and ordered him several times to surrender and keep his hands in sight, police said.
Sgt. Lou Cruz said Moppin refused to surrender and was yelling and swearing at the officers. At one point, he told the officers he didnt care about being shot, Cruz said.
The officers told investigators they both shot at Moppin when he made a quick move toward his rear waistband like he was reaching for a gun.
Moppin was wounded more than once and died about a half-hour later at a local hospital.
The passengers in the car later told police they had been partying earlier. An open bottle of liquor was found in the car.
...Two officers not involved in the car stop found him and ordered him several times to surrender and keep his hands in sight, police said.
Sgt. Lou Cruz said Moppin refused to surrender and was yelling and swearing at the officers. At one point, he told the officers he didnt care about being shot, Cruz said.
The officers told investigators they both shot at Moppin when he made a quick move toward his rear waistband like he was reaching for a gun.
Moppin was wounded more than once and died about a half-hour later at a local hospital.
The passengers in the car later told police they had been partying earlier. An open bottle of liquor was found in the car.
01-14-2009, 09:06 AM
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Mack Woodfox III and Andrew Moppin were both killed and the same officer was involved in both shootings. He claimed that both were reaching for a gun, however no gun was found.
Police said Jimenez shot 27-year-old Mack "Jody" Woodfox III because he thought Woodfox was reaching into his waistband for a gun, although no gun was found. Jimenez gave the same reason for taking part in the fatal shooting New Year's Eve 2007 of another man, Andrew Moppin, who, like Woodfox, turned out to be unarmed.
Police and a deputy from the district attorney's office interviewed Jimenez after the Woodfox shooting, then went out to the scene at night and re-enacted the incident as the officer related it.
The result - although technically the case is still pending, no charges have been filed.
Police and a deputy from the district attorney's office interviewed Jimenez after the Woodfox shooting, then went out to the scene at night and re-enacted the incident as the officer related it.
The result - although technically the case is still pending, no charges have been filed.
01-14-2009, 09:28 AM
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Yeah I agree not debating that at all. These are just a few of the deaths that some people believe were "uncalled for". Me personally, if they were reaching for a gun then what can you do?
I listed those because one of the major debating points by other are the "excessive" use of force. Its something that comes up often with these discussions. I personally think reaching while at gun point is stupid. However for the sake of arguing what else people are talking about, they were posted.
They also speak of other events in the US as a whole and not just Oakland but again... I understand your view on it.
I listed those because one of the major debating points by other are the "excessive" use of force. Its something that comes up often with these discussions. I personally think reaching while at gun point is stupid. However for the sake of arguing what else people are talking about, they were posted.
They also speak of other events in the US as a whole and not just Oakland but again... I understand your view on it.
01-14-2009, 09:38 AM
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Ok smart ***:
Jose Luis Buenrostro - 15 year old killed unarmed walking back from the corner store.
Jerrold Cornelius Hall - Shot in the back with a shotgun because he "fit the description" of someone who stole a $60 walkman, oh yes, he was unarmed.
Bruce Seward - Shot by Bart Police after being found passed out in a dumpster; that means he is worthy of being shot and killed since he was unarmed and passed out in a dumpster.... yeah... and naked... yeah he was naked.
Mack Woodfox III - Shot by a cop at fruitvale, was unarmed as the officer claims he was reaching for a weapon, No weapon found.
Andrew Moppin - THE SAME OFFICER who shot and kill Mack, killed Andrew Moppin in a similar incident, "he was reaching for a gun". No weapon found on Andrew.
Should I name more? Because I have more........
Jose Luis Buenrostro - 15 year old killed unarmed walking back from the corner store.
Jerrold Cornelius Hall - Shot in the back with a shotgun because he "fit the description" of someone who stole a $60 walkman, oh yes, he was unarmed.
Bruce Seward - Shot by Bart Police after being found passed out in a dumpster; that means he is worthy of being shot and killed since he was unarmed and passed out in a dumpster.... yeah... and naked... yeah he was naked.
Mack Woodfox III - Shot by a cop at fruitvale, was unarmed as the officer claims he was reaching for a weapon, No weapon found.
Andrew Moppin - THE SAME OFFICER who shot and kill Mack, killed Andrew Moppin in a similar incident, "he was reaching for a gun". No weapon found on Andrew.
Should I name more? Because I have more........
Jose Buenrostro ARE YOU KIDDING ME!!! HE PULLED A SAWED OFF RIFLE FROM HIS PANTS!! It was a sawed off .22 Caliber. When told to stop by the police, he pulled the rifle and turned towards officers.
Jerrold Cornelius Hall - BART POLICE NOT OPD. (But while you brought it up, according to federal law, it is LEGAL to shoot a fleeing felon in the back. Not sure if this is bart's policy or not, i know it is NOT OPD's policy.)
Bruce Seward - (BART POLICE AGAIN BUT ILL PLAY) Officer David Betancourt, a 22-year law enforcement veteran, shot a naked Bruce Seward outside the Hayward BART station before dawn on Memorial Day in 2001. Seward, 42, was asleep on a bench and appeared unconscious. After calling for an ambulance, Betancourt approached when Seward woke up, grabbed the officer's nightstick and swung (lethal force justified, the man was not initially armed but armed himself with the officers baton), smacking the patrol car, police said. Betancourt used pepper spray on Seward, but it had no effect, police said.
Mack Woodfox III , Andrew Moppin. - I dont know all the details on these two, but it Appears the officer feared for his safety due to both of them reaching for their waistband.
Im not saying that bad things dont happen to good people. Officers sometimes screw the hooch pretty bad. But you need to allow the justice system to do what it was designed to do.
Ive heard of people reaching toward their waistband inorder to "scare the police" as a tactic for them to gain time to run. And yes he got shot because of it.
If an officer feels threatened with his life, and he reasonably believes the subject may be armed, and feels that subject poses a plausabile risk, Deadly force is justified. If your a drunk driving subject, who runs from police and reaches towards his waistband while running............. I would probably think he has a gun or some other type of weapon.
MOST criminals (when carrying a firearm) carry it around their waistband. It would be unusual for a person, who has nothing to hide, to run from the police, especially after being told they are not free to leave (detained). It would be even more unusual for a person of ordinary care and prudance to reach for their wasteband while running from you.
NOW If you still want to play... lets play.
