Thanks, Janq, for the links... All my inclination towards buying an EVO due to the long wait for the STi went away! That's just plain sad for all those who bought the Evos and ran into problems already. I had my Integra which was approaching the 100k miles mark, and I never heard any weird noice like that (And I did shift pretty aggressively).

 

You're welcome sub-newbie!

BTW, don't think me an EVO hater (I'm not) or a Mitsubishi hater as I have zero to gain toward either. But I am a realist and a consumer. As a realist I tend to look beyond the hype & rhetoric of the EVO 'mystique' and its frankly impressive history. Although the previous generations were super kick-azz they aren't here in NA. What we do have is a cool vehicle when its operating properly. But it seems from the owners own posts that the car is either overstressed (my best guess) and/or suffering from poor/sub standard quality control which Mitsubishi has a long history for having. Look back to the maint & repair horror story of Diamante, Galant, 3000 GT/VR-4 owners. The first gen Eclipse of the mid to late '80's seemed to be put together pretty well but even that line suffered after gen II was released. Their truck line is marignally better.

In my mind build quality is just as much a performance item as top speed, braking or handling. I mean what good is having a super fast awesome car if it can only be super fast and awesome for 2K miles at a stretch before requiring a visit to the dealer for repairs. Thats where my 'consumer' part comes in to play.
If the EVO were anything else other than a car such as a really cool Plasma screen TV, or an awesome refrigerator or some other expensive appliance toy...folks would be returnign the product to the store for their money back. But of course you can't just return your EVO so then people make up excuses such as 'I don't mind the rear wing having bubbles as it doesn't make my car go faster' or 'the rattling noise can't be heard over the radio'. What the heck? I'm not going to pay $30K (not including _interest_ on the loan/lease!) so that I can makeup excuses as to why the car is okay even though its falling apart around me. Some of those folks are deluded themselves.

Oh, and what do they think is going to happen to their resale value now that its becoming known that these cars are struggling to stay together after only being on the street 90 days or so. Who in their right mind would buy a used one a year or two or three from now when they have 10, 20 or 30K miles on them.
Now a car should never be considered an investment but still depreciation is something you want to keep at bay.
From what I'm hearing and seeing if I couldn't get an STi I'd just move on to somethign else altogether. The EVO is not on my list at all no matter how fast/quick/swift they make it or how long the "bumper to bumper" warranty might be.

I'd much prefer to ride & drive all day long in my 'slow' STi, than beg & plead for a warranty repair of an EVO.

- Janq

"A fool and his money will soon be parted." - P.T. Barnum

 

My God, all of these Evo horror stories just make me want to cry! I feel so horrible for those new Evo owners, because I know the sick feeling it would give me in the pit of my stomach if it was ME. Some of those Evo guys just bought their Evos last week. Many haven't even paid their taxes or tags yet, and they are getting these tranny grinding noises, failed clutches, bubbling carbon fiber wings, etc. That's just WRONG!! And Mitsu is poo-pooing their claims, saying the tranny grinding and wing carbon-fiber bubbling is NORMAL, and that clutch failure at 2000 miles is ABUSE?!?!? WTF!?!

For the past couple months I have been truly 50/50 torn between getting the Evo or the STi. I was inches from trading in my 02 WRX Wagon on a blue Evo with sunroof. But, I forced myself to hold off and wait for the STi before making my decision. That was VERY difficult, as the Evo is such a tough looking car and the reviews were so great...

Now, there is just NO way I will buy an Evo (well, not a 2003 anyway). Maybe I will take a re-look at the 2004 models *IF* Mitsu steps up to the plate, admits and fixes the 2003s, AND corrects the production defects in 2004. Those are big IFs.

Plus, this is fugging up the STi vs Evo balance, which is I think is VERY necessary to keep both cars alive in the U.S. This could be bad for both Evo and STi owners in the long run. I want to see both Evos and STis on the streets, a good rivalry like the Camaro/Mustangs of yore. I don't want just EVERYBODY in STis, what's the fun.

Like Janq, I'm not an Evo basher or an STi zealot...I'm thrilled with both cars coming to the U.S. and plan to buy the one that best suits me. Well, until now anyway. I had huge hopes for the Evo and now they've been crushed. Further, this makes me wary about the STi now too. I still have high hopes for the STi, but now I'm gonna force myself to wait until at least Christmas so the STi has 6 months in driver's hands to shake out any similar problems. The one big plus in the STi's favor is that my 02 WRX Wagon has been great so far, without a single problem.

Thanks Mitsubishi for lending credibility to all of these "Mitsu reliability" legends.

 

Janq,

Subaru's record isn't exactly flawless either. These quotes are from the EvolutionM forum from members who have owned both brands of vehicles with the hyper link for the forum members' convenience.

http://forums.evolutionm.net/showthr...&pagenumber=10

Allright guys, let me share my story about my wrx. The noise that you guys are dicribing was also heard in my wrx. I took my wrx in about 15 times and to 3 different dealers. All of them admitted that they heard the noise but didn't want to fix it. They kept on saying it is normal. Subaru has the worst service of all car makers. You guys are lucky that Mits is willing to look into the problem. Finally one dealer is willing help me out. After 4 visits and fixes the noise gotten worst. I got a good lawer and sued the hell out of subaru. We used "the lemon law". I got all of my $$ and my lawer got his share of $4,000 from suby.


http://forums.evolutionm.net/showthr...&pagenumber=15

I have the decel noise in my car as well. I had this same noise in my 2000 Impreza 2.5RS. In my Impreza, the sound was steadily getting louder, which is a sign that something was failing. If the sound in our EVO's stays consistent, I might not worry too much about it. however, if the sounds keeps getting louder, that is a sign that someting is failing, a bearing or gear etc. I have a feeling that Mitsubishi will put out a recall notice or technical service bulletin about this noise...


http://forums.evolutionm.net/showthr...&pagenumber=12


My WRX had the same thing, it was the clutch assembly. I am hoping it is the same for the Evo and not the tranny..

http://forums.evolutionm.net/showthr...5&pagenumber=9

A friend who rode in my car yesterday who owns an 02 WRX said it sounds nearly identical to what his Suby did until they offered a warrantly replacement on the clutch-pressure plate. Apparently, it made this aweful grinding-rattling noise that was so annoying that subaru just warranty replaced anyone who wanted a new one, even though there was no harmful effects.


I can almost gaurantee that the clutch assembly and/or the throwout bearing will be the culprit which is an easy fix.

 

02MaximizedVQ,

Of course some owners of Subie products have had some issues and I never said Subie had a "flawless" record. Having owned four Subies produced from the '80s to the early '90's I can tell 'stories' of broken parts too.

But as with most things in life, it's all relative.
Specifically no manufacturer has a "flawless" record, as even the vaunted gold standard for reliability, Lexus, has had recalls and quality issues at times. But as product reliability and build quality is concerend Subaru is in the top tier of manufacturers along with Toyota and Honda.

The bigger picture though is that relative to Mitsu having a _large_ percentage of _broad & varying_ quality issues with the EVO, a Subaru owner here and there having a problem of any sort is of no comparison in terms of scale.

The bottom line is when Mitsubishi is able to state that greater than 90% of their products dating back to the early '80's are still on US roads and in use (as based on reported registrations & license plates issued nation wide), then they will be comparable to Subaru. The facts are though that this is not the case for Mitsu nor is it the case for many other marques.

Facts are Mitsu products, especially their cars, have historically questionable if not sub-par manufacturing and reliability issues. That cannot be disputed and the recent EVO problems is just another chapter in that long history.

- Janq

"I don't make the news, I just report it."

 

Just think, when is the last time you saw a Subie of any age or model borken down on the side of the road or being dragged behind a tow truck?

It just doesn't happen too often.
Yes there are of course Subies that break or fail on ocassion.
But their is no website anywhere with owners complaining of as many varying issues toward a single model/version of a Subie as Mitsu has with its US EVO.

No matter how you do the math or look at the numbers, its plainly obvious that the US EVO is having numerous build quality issues. Even Ray Charles can see that.

Now its possible that after the STi hits the streets it too may suffer issues. But based on results and past history there is a very low probability for such.

- Janq

 

Hey guys im not here to cause any wars or anything, but about the issuse of the EVO's trannys getting messed up is mostly due to stupid drivers, that would happen to any car if u **** pound it and grind every gear and slip the clutch like hell. A car no matter what it is will brake if u drive it like a dumb ***. It will probally happen to the STI to when some kid gets one and just beats the hell out of it, **** breaks if you dont take care of it. I am not at all bias towards the EVO because i own one, i almost bought a WRX before I bought my car but it just depends on personal preference. Just be glad that Mitsu. and Subbie brought these cars to the USA and just enjoy them instead of saying one sucks *** and the one u own is far supperior because thats what u own. Both cars are awsome.

 

No flame inteded...but Heymister is correct, though only to a certain degree.

Yes there are owners who are ragging the holy hell out of their cars and then wnodering why they fell apart in their hands.
At one of the HUMMER (aka 'H1' - Original & real hummer!) owners board the same thing happens and folks/dummies complain that they didn't know they HUMMER could be broken.
Later they discover that even the HUMMER requires maintenance and care.

The thing with the EVO is that there are a lot of owners who have not raced or ragged their car and even some who have less than 100 miles on their cars yet and still they are having major issues. And thats only the clutch, never mind the rattling transmission/idler gear, or the CF wing that bubbles and delaminates and the body rattling & buzzing, etc.
Thos issues have nothing to do with drivng the car hard and are more related to quality control.
Worst, folks are trying to take advantage of the "Full Coverage Bumper to Bumper" warranty as marketed by Mitsu and are getting told the caris acting and/or aging normally/as expected. Thats a problem.

Go check out any of thelinks posted earlier and you'll see.
Its ugly and only gettng worst.

- Janq

 

I don't think this is true. Many of the Evo owners I've read on the Evo site were still in their "break in" periods on their cars, taking special care to not do hard starts or high RPMs until past 1,000 miles and they STILL had some of these problems. That doesn't make them a "stupid driver" to me, just dudes like you and me who anticipated the car, read the boards and reviews, and then bought it all happy and giddy. A couple weeks later they find that their tranny is making wierd grinding sounds, their clutch is slipping, and/or their carbon fiber wing is bubbling in spots. Further, Mitsubishi is refusing to fix these problems. And all of this before many of these guys have even bought their tags.

No, this hasn't happened to ALL of the Evos, and maybe SOME of the Evos tranny/clutch problems were caused by dumb drivers. However, the number of Evo owners reporting these problems seems fairly high, indicating some probable manufacturing quality issues.

Again, I'm pro Evo and pro STi. Not trying to bash the Evo, just stating that these problems and Mitsu response just plain suck. If the STi experiences these problems, I'll be just as disappointed.

 

What he said. ^^

A dog gone shame.

- Janq

 

I have over 1000 miles on my EVO, I drive the hell out of it (not beat it, just drive it hard), and I have had no problems at all. No squeaks, rattles, bubbles, or clunks. She runs like a clock so I have no worries. Coming off of a 2001 GTI that clunked and rattled on a daily basis I am actually impressed by the EVOs construction.

There is always a possibility of problems with new cars and I'm sure that the STI will have it's fair share (although I hope your STIs are trouble free).

We should all be happy that both cars are here, b/c the STI probably would have never shown up if it wasn't for the EVO, and the EVO wouldn't be here w/o the sucess of the WRX.

We should be exstatic rigth now b/c it is a great time to be a car fan. When is the last time you could remember so many fantastic cars coming out at the same time? Enzos, Carrera GTs, Ford GTs, Oh My!!!