Someone bring me up to speed on borlas
Guest
Posts: n/a
Ok, how loud is it over stock. I hate loud loud exuasts. even if it sounds nice. I used to have a cobra...and the exaust my uncle had on there was dam loud. (kenny brown IIRC).
Also, so where do you feel the power?
what about cats? does one come with? reuse stock? I don't want a cell all the time.
also recomendations to where to order them from.
Thanks guys.
-neal
Also, so where do you feel the power?
what about cats? does one come with? reuse stock? I don't want a cell all the time.
also recomendations to where to order them from.
Thanks guys.
-neal
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Someone bring me up to speed on borlas
Originally posted by DoctorNick
Ok, I don't wanna ask this because I don't want all the million of do a search, this has been beaten to death blah blah blah.
Realy this is the deal: I was going to go turbo so I never though I would need more effecient headers and I also tapped my stock ones for EGT. But now thinking about it. I might be worth it to get better headers. So. I was wondering if you guys can bring me up to speed on the borla header situation.
Which gen are we on? Do they still break? Where do you put an EGT probe if you use these headers....still cyl 3?
What kinda stock power gain have you guys been getting? Any CELs? Will they fit on an auto? Loss of low end torque?
Thanks guys..
-Neal
Ok, I don't wanna ask this because I don't want all the million of do a search, this has been beaten to death blah blah blah.
Realy this is the deal: I was going to go turbo so I never though I would need more effecient headers and I also tapped my stock ones for EGT. But now thinking about it. I might be worth it to get better headers. So. I was wondering if you guys can bring me up to speed on the borla header situation.
Which gen are we on? Do they still break? Where do you put an EGT probe if you use these headers....still cyl 3?
What kinda stock power gain have you guys been getting? Any CELs? Will they fit on an auto? Loss of low end torque?
Thanks guys..
-Neal
I am going to go with a stock turbo manifold, with an aftermarket replacement exhaust for up/dn mid and muff. THe performance isn't there for buying aftermarket headers on a turboed car for the money spent. 400 HP is enough to dirty my underwear, and the stock exhaust manifold is not going to be a brick wall from reaching that. The main reason that I would shy away from using the Borla for a turbo application is that it is not a strong piece. People have not had problems with it running it on an NA car (aside from the cracking), buy when you bolt 30-40 lbs of turbo up and down pipes on it, people have reported problems with it eventually sagging under the added stress of holding up that extra weight. I would wager that the heat also has something to do with the sagging as well.
If you must have a header for NA use before your turbo, get the TWE header. I would have bought it instead of what I have now, and would have used it for turboing as well, but I feel that using standard aftermarket parts will be the best bet for the least ammount of headachs and custom work.
cheeRS,
Greg
Guest
Posts: n/a
I have the Gen III headers, cobb CAI, stromung mid pipe and stromung single tip exhaust on my MY01 sedan and this is what I have noticed.
There is a little big of bog in the low end but after a while you don't really notice it, the mid range is good at about 3k the torque starts to kick in and this is where the fun starts. From 3k to redline, first off you'll notice the noise it gets freakin' loud in the cabin the car is very responsive and doesn't have as much throttle drop as stock. By throttle drop I mean the car lurching forward when you get off the gas. You will also notice how much more freely the rpm's climb and they will climb fast, faster than stock. According to my butt dyno the car does seem to have a steeper power curve and there is more oomph in the higher rpms. I have however noticed a flat spot in the power curve at about 48k but it is only about 300rpm wide then the car takes off like a shot.
But like any type of mod that has to do with intake and exhaust the only way to truley get all the power out of it, is to change the timing and that requires cam work. So if you want marginal upgrades in power and large upgrades in noise then go for the headers.
Oh about the noise of the car... Your car will sound awesome, it's deep, burbly, throaty and sounds so damn good. When ever the Mrs. drops me off and drives away I can't help but smile for the sound of my car. Also it replaces your first cat and if you get them installed correctly (thank you Smart Service in Shoreline
) you won't have any issues with the CEL.
Hope this helps.
[b]
There is a little big of bog in the low end but after a while you don't really notice it, the mid range is good at about 3k the torque starts to kick in and this is where the fun starts. From 3k to redline, first off you'll notice the noise it gets freakin' loud in the cabin the car is very responsive and doesn't have as much throttle drop as stock. By throttle drop I mean the car lurching forward when you get off the gas. You will also notice how much more freely the rpm's climb and they will climb fast, faster than stock. According to my butt dyno the car does seem to have a steeper power curve and there is more oomph in the higher rpms. I have however noticed a flat spot in the power curve at about 48k but it is only about 300rpm wide then the car takes off like a shot.
But like any type of mod that has to do with intake and exhaust the only way to truley get all the power out of it, is to change the timing and that requires cam work. So if you want marginal upgrades in power and large upgrades in noise then go for the headers.
Oh about the noise of the car... Your car will sound awesome, it's deep, burbly, throaty and sounds so damn good. When ever the Mrs. drops me off and drives away I can't help but smile for the sound of my car. Also it replaces your first cat and if you get them installed correctly (thank you Smart Service in Shoreline
) you won't have any issues with the CEL. Hope this helps.
[b]
Guest
Posts: n/a
Weren't www.generationplastics.com making a fairly cheap equal length manifold?
Big Baller
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,821
From: Washington
Car Info: 93 BG5, 00&01 GM6, 06LGT, 07STi
Originally posted by 25RS 2NV
OK i had them and this is my take on em. First off there bnot worth the money. Unless you want just sound. they do sound awsome. Performance wise you lose power wiuthout a doubt. i did get a check engine every 2500-3000 miles. just my 2 cents.
Erik
OK i had them and this is my take on em. First off there bnot worth the money. Unless you want just sound. they do sound awsome. Performance wise you lose power wiuthout a doubt. i did get a check engine every 2500-3000 miles. just my 2 cents.
Erik
Some people get CEL's. I did until I wrapped the headers. The CEL went away and that rattling sound that people gripe about also went away. So the car sounded smooth, mean and performed better. Now that the Borlas are on sale for 275 bucks, I would say they are worth every penny. People who have them and wrapped them will probably tell you the same.
If you go turbo, they will hurt your spool a little bit because you lose some exhaust gas velocity. However, some cams will remedy that. Also, any turbo kit for a stock RS will bolt right up. Brullen and MRT headers would require a TON of fabricating to make most turbo kits work.
Parallel fuel rail modification is a VERY good idea. If you go turbo (and run any respectable amount of boost) the fuel rail mod is a necessity. This also means you can put the EGT in the uppipe and not in no.3 primary, so you don't run as high of a risk of cracking your headers.
edited for content because they *'d the word b***h as in gripe and complain.
Last edited by ImprezaRSX; Dec 3, 2002 at 11:44 AM.
Big Baller
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,821
From: Washington
Car Info: 93 BG5, 00&01 GM6, 06LGT, 07STi
one more thing. ...
on adding a turbo:
fabricating a support from the turbo to the block would be pretty easy and would prevent any cracking or sagging for sure. I'll be doing it when I get mine.
on adding a turbo:
fabricating a support from the turbo to the block would be pretty easy and would prevent any cracking or sagging for sure. I'll be doing it when I get mine.
NASIOC Slut
iTrader: (2)
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 4,723
From: Roseville, CA
Car Info: 1995 Subaru Impreza 1.8 L
Originally posted by ImprezaRSX
I disagree. In fact, I couldn't disagree more. I noticed a big difference in my car. Fourth and fifth gear pull much harder now. ALL gears do, but 4th and 5th were the most noticeable. Not to mention the car sounds great.
Some people get CEL's. I did until I wrapped the headers. The CEL went away and that rattling sound that people ***** about also went away. So the car sounded smooth, mean and performed better. Now that the Borlas are on sale for 275 bucks, I would say they are worth every penny. People who have them and wrapped them will probably tell you the same.
I disagree. In fact, I couldn't disagree more. I noticed a big difference in my car. Fourth and fifth gear pull much harder now. ALL gears do, but 4th and 5th were the most noticeable. Not to mention the car sounds great.
Some people get CEL's. I did until I wrapped the headers. The CEL went away and that rattling sound that people ***** about also went away. So the car sounded smooth, mean and performed better. Now that the Borlas are on sale for 275 bucks, I would say they are worth every penny. People who have them and wrapped them will probably tell you the same.
For the money, I would get the MRT's and the better performance.
Big Baller
iTrader: (1)
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 1,821
From: Washington
Car Info: 93 BG5, 00&01 GM6, 06LGT, 07STi
Originally posted by Kostamojen
I think that a comparison to other headers would show the borla's do not give as good of improvement as the rest of the field... They are much easier to work with and buy, as well as are stainless steel, which makes them apealing.
For the money, I would get the MRT's and the better performance.
I think that a comparison to other headers would show the borla's do not give as good of improvement as the rest of the field... They are much easier to work with and buy, as well as are stainless steel, which makes them apealing.
For the money, I would get the MRT's and the better performance.
NASIOC Slut
iTrader: (2)
Joined: Nov 2002
Posts: 4,723
From: Roseville, CA
Car Info: 1995 Subaru Impreza 1.8 L
Originally posted by ImprezaRSX
You are correct. The Brullen's and the MRT's give bigger power gains. However, adding a turbo kit to those headers would be a huge hassle. Also, the extra piping for that kind of project would hurt your turbo lag even more than the borlas.
You are correct. The Brullen's and the MRT's give bigger power gains. However, adding a turbo kit to those headers would be a huge hassle. Also, the extra piping for that kind of project would hurt your turbo lag even more than the borlas.