View Poll Results: Do you believe in a god?
Yes
41
62.12%
No
25
37.88%
Voters: 66. You may not vote on this poll
Do you believe in God?
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Originally posted by Steppin Razor
You lost me on that one. Care to elaborate?
You lost me on that one. Care to elaborate?
Make sense?
jason
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Originally posted by christoph1371
One cannot DECIDE to believe in a God because there is no empirical evidence to weigh the pros or cons.
One cannot DECIDE to believe in a God because there is no empirical evidence to weigh the pros or cons.
Believing… i.e. FAITH is a choice. Choices are made free and clear of any logical thought. There are no ands, ifs, buts, or becauses. It just IS period.
example: Homer Jay states, "I personally can not willingly believe in a god as most religions have described him/her/it or if at all. Right now I lean towards not"
In this example Homer is deciding not to believe on the basis of how or how not "most religions have described him/her/it"
Now I am not making fun of Homer. Homer isn't right or wrong. How can anyone who believes what they believe be right or wrong?
The point I am making is that believing/ faith is a choice.
In this example Homer is deciding not to believe on the basis of how or how not "most religions have described him/her/it"
Now I am not making fun of Homer. Homer isn't right or wrong. How can anyone who believes what they believe be right or wrong?
The point I am making is that believing/ faith is a choice.
It is very difficult for people, including myself, to sit back and not "think" about the hows and whys of life.
The su[c]kiest part is that we learned to be this way. When we were kids, things "were" just because they "were"...period. [/B]
Last edited by Steppin Razor; Feb 10, 2003 at 02:20 PM.
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Originally posted by mmboost
If our understanding of the Universe is imperfect (proven by our ever-changing laws of science), perhaps then God has merely worked outside our limited understanding and still within the realm of the true nature of the universe.... which currently eludes us but not him.
Make sense?
jason
If our understanding of the Universe is imperfect (proven by our ever-changing laws of science), perhaps then God has merely worked outside our limited understanding and still within the realm of the true nature of the universe.... which currently eludes us but not him.
Make sense?
jason
So Do you believe in God or not? Your original posts seem to say no, but this one seems to say yes. 
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Sure my job title or my diploma may say “scientist”, that that does not mean much. To me it means that I work/study and my brain follows certain patterns and thought processes much related to the field that people call, “science”.
Just because I revel in gathering data to aid in my work/discovery does not mean that I am bound to the rules prescribed to me by the social conscience.
NO one can make or unmake my mind. I alone have the power to create ANYTHING. In short no one controls my brains activity. However, just because it hasn’t happened to me doesn’t mean it does not exist. Perhaps, somewhere in/outthere it does exist?
When conversation ensues we consciously choose or decide on what to acknowledge.
One day things/people all acknowledged that “x” would be named “hand”. Milliseconds later…hand existed.
One day religion didn’t exist. The next it did. Who invented it? We did of course.
People now- a-days forget that they alone are the creators of their world. Language is truly an AWESOME responsibility. Things come into existence or out of existence by mere thought/words. It is so powerful that it is frightening. Hence there are some people do not want that responsibility.
The people who don’t want that responsibility are the ones who blame (the haters is you will) all on everything but themselves. They are perfect and right all the time. They fool some people but not all.
Just because I revel in gathering data to aid in my work/discovery does not mean that I am bound to the rules prescribed to me by the social conscience.
NO one can make or unmake my mind. I alone have the power to create ANYTHING. In short no one controls my brains activity. However, just because it hasn’t happened to me doesn’t mean it does not exist. Perhaps, somewhere in/outthere it does exist?
When conversation ensues we consciously choose or decide on what to acknowledge.
One day things/people all acknowledged that “x” would be named “hand”. Milliseconds later…hand existed.
One day religion didn’t exist. The next it did. Who invented it? We did of course.
People now- a-days forget that they alone are the creators of their world. Language is truly an AWESOME responsibility. Things come into existence or out of existence by mere thought/words. It is so powerful that it is frightening. Hence there are some people do not want that responsibility.
The people who don’t want that responsibility are the ones who blame (the haters is you will) all on everything but themselves. They are perfect and right all the time. They fool some people but not all.
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btw i do believe in other things besides humans.
There are trillions of "stars" out there. I am not so rude and arrogant to think I am the only one.
"Now that is a cop out. We did not learn to be this way. Our brains became more sophisticated as we became older and allowed us to ponder more delicate situations."
hahaha, how do you think you became "more sophisticated" . I am sorry you are no pioneer. You learned it from others. We were all "educated" to how others(parents/schools/society) people believed was the best for us.
If you took a baby and put it in a void. do you think it would ponder anything? it would have no language, no food, no anything. It couldn't ponder anything because it wouldn't know how to.
There are trillions of "stars" out there. I am not so rude and arrogant to think I am the only one.
"Now that is a cop out. We did not learn to be this way. Our brains became more sophisticated as we became older and allowed us to ponder more delicate situations."
hahaha, how do you think you became "more sophisticated" . I am sorry you are no pioneer. You learned it from others. We were all "educated" to how others(parents/schools/society) people believed was the best for us.
If you took a baby and put it in a void. do you think it would ponder anything? it would have no language, no food, no anything. It couldn't ponder anything because it wouldn't know how to.
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[QUOTE]Originally posted by christoph1371
One day religion didn’t exist. The next it did. Who invented it? We did of course.[quote]
Wow. You've got to realize that most religious people believe very strongly that their religion was created by a GOD.
That's my beef with religious people -- they give credit to a "god" when something good happens to them rather than realizing that it was actually the result of their efforts that got them where they are.
That is deep. And at the same time strikes a chord with my thoughts.
On a totally different note, I think it's a common belief that people who enjoy cars and everything about them are generally not intelligent people. It's nice to be able to have this kind of discussion with those very type of people.
One day religion didn’t exist. The next it did. Who invented it? We did of course.[quote]
Wow. You've got to realize that most religious people believe very strongly that their religion was created by a GOD.
People now-a-days forget that they alone are the creators of their world.
Language is truly an AWESOME responsibility. Things come into existence or out of existence by mere thought/words. It is so powerful that it is frightening. Hence there are some people do not want that responsibility.
The people who don’t want that responsibility are the ones (the haters if you will) who blame all on everything but themselves. They are perfect and right all the time. They fool some people but not all. [/B]
The people who don’t want that responsibility are the ones (the haters if you will) who blame all on everything but themselves. They are perfect and right all the time. They fool some people but not all. [/B]
On a totally different note, I think it's a common belief that people who enjoy cars and everything about them are generally not intelligent people. It's nice to be able to have this kind of discussion with those very type of people.
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1. I believe there is a GOD, and I will continue to believe such until someone can PROVE to me that there is not a GOD.
2. Science is crap (when it comes to this topic anyway, scientists have made some great finds...). Let me elaborate. first off science is based on theories and math. lets talk theories.
a theory is something that has yet to be proven, yet generally scientists agree that the theory is true. therefore i could propose the theory that God is real.
secondly math. most experiments are linked to math in one way or another, maybe not directly, but indirectly at least.
so what is math based on?
well math is based on the x,y,z planes of existince. and at the root of all math is a POINT. a definition of a point, is a location in space that has NO height, NO depth, and NO width. so all math is based on something which does not exist, which means all science is based on something that does not exist.
so in conclusion there is a GOD, i open it to all comers to conclusively prove otherwise.
2. Science is crap (when it comes to this topic anyway, scientists have made some great finds...). Let me elaborate. first off science is based on theories and math. lets talk theories.
a theory is something that has yet to be proven, yet generally scientists agree that the theory is true. therefore i could propose the theory that God is real.
secondly math. most experiments are linked to math in one way or another, maybe not directly, but indirectly at least.
so what is math based on?
well math is based on the x,y,z planes of existince. and at the root of all math is a POINT. a definition of a point, is a location in space that has NO height, NO depth, and NO width. so all math is based on something which does not exist, which means all science is based on something that does not exist.
so in conclusion there is a GOD, i open it to all comers to conclusively prove otherwise.
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razor: I like to share such ideas too.
It's good brian errr uhhh brain food
remember we are human beings.
we are not called human doings.
So why do we spend all our time DOING and not BEING?
It's good brian errr uhhh brain food
remember we are human beings.
we are not called human doings.
So why do we spend all our time DOING and not BEING?
Last edited by christoph1371; Feb 10, 2003 at 04:51 PM.
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boxer - no one has to prove anything to you. You can make the chioce to believe what ever you want.
if you choose "A"..great
Perhaps choose "b"...even better
becareful in thinking that choices must be what society calls "right". The choice is yours and doesn't have to mean anything to anyone but yourself.
if you choose "A"..great
Perhaps choose "b"...even better
becareful in thinking that choices must be what society calls "right". The choice is yours and doesn't have to mean anything to anyone but yourself.
I don't think you guys got where I was going. Let's just leave it saying that I don't believe in God, Allah, Vishnu( well certain Vishnu's I believe since he's got proven HP to back it up ), etc.
), etc.
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Homer, trust us we got it.
We have just been exploring thoughts on other levels.
For those of you that prefer more visual stimulation then perhaps your next dvd pick should be the Matrix.
There is alot more to that movie than kool graphics. Actually they discuss many old skools of thought and philosophy.
We have just been exploring thoughts on other levels.
For those of you that prefer more visual stimulation then perhaps your next dvd pick should be the Matrix.
There is alot more to that movie than kool graphics. Actually they discuss many old skools of thought and philosophy.
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Originally posted by boxer
1. I believe there is a GOD, and I will continue to believe such until someone can PROVE to me that there is not a GOD.
1. I believe there is a GOD, and I will continue to believe such until someone can PROVE to me that there is not a GOD.
http://atheism.about.com/library/FAQ...ism_burden.htm
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i just read through the link (http://atheism.about.com/library/FA...eism_burden.htm) above. Interesting thoughts.
I find it a tad funny though that someone spent all that time writing to justify (or not) their beliefs.
If you believe something, why is it sooo important to make someone else see your point!? WHY? because it validates your opinion/thought/existence.
We all need to be validated in some fashion, "look at my cool shoes" , "look at my new car parts" , "look at my fancy jewels", "look at my great post on i-club"
It's great to be loved. But, some people really don't feel the love. The have low self esteem and low self worth/value. Hence the (what I call), "look at me" syndrome.
To me it is a greater challenge: to feel confident in yourself and your own beliefs, to walk the road less traveled, and to BE yourself.
I find it a tad funny though that someone spent all that time writing to justify (or not) their beliefs.
If you believe something, why is it sooo important to make someone else see your point!? WHY? because it validates your opinion/thought/existence.
We all need to be validated in some fashion, "look at my cool shoes" , "look at my new car parts" , "look at my fancy jewels", "look at my great post on i-club"
It's great to be loved. But, some people really don't feel the love. The have low self esteem and low self worth/value. Hence the (what I call), "look at me" syndrome.
To me it is a greater challenge: to feel confident in yourself and your own beliefs, to walk the road less traveled, and to BE yourself.
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Originally posted by christoph1371
i just read through the link (http://atheism.about.com/library/FA...eism_burden.htm) above. Interesting thoughts.
I find it a tad funny though that someone spent all that time writing to justify (or not) their beliefs.
If you believe something, why is it sooo important to make someone else see your point!? WHY? because it validates your opinion/thought/existence.
We all need to be validated in some fashion, "look at my cool shoes" , "look at my new car parts" , "look at my fancy jewels", "look at my great post on i-club"
It's great to be loved. But, some people really don't feel the love. The have low self esteem and low self worth/value. Hence the (what I call), "look at me" syndrome.
To me it is a greater challenge: to feel confident in yourself and your own beliefs, to walk the road less traveled, and to BE yourself.
i just read through the link (http://atheism.about.com/library/FA...eism_burden.htm) above. Interesting thoughts.
I find it a tad funny though that someone spent all that time writing to justify (or not) their beliefs.
If you believe something, why is it sooo important to make someone else see your point!? WHY? because it validates your opinion/thought/existence.
We all need to be validated in some fashion, "look at my cool shoes" , "look at my new car parts" , "look at my fancy jewels", "look at my great post on i-club"
It's great to be loved. But, some people really don't feel the love. The have low self esteem and low self worth/value. Hence the (what I call), "look at me" syndrome.
To me it is a greater challenge: to feel confident in yourself and your own beliefs, to walk the road less traveled, and to BE yourself.
If you believe something as important to your everyday life as a belief in an OOCOA, I think it is very important to be able to explain to other reasonable human beings why you do such a thing. If I told you that I believed my car could outrun any other car on the street, and I really truly did believe that, I believe we would have a problem. The fact that my car can absolutely not outrun any other can on the street is directly contradictory to my belief and thus makes by belief untrue and makes me delusional.
While I have agreed with most of your statements in this thread, I don't think it is outrageous to be able to explain your beliefs in a rational manner if another reasonable human being asks. On the other hand, I find it unbelievably obnoxious when people try to push a set of beliefs on other people. This may be what you meant by the "look at me" syndrome. And just for the record, low self esteem is merely one of many reasons people feel they must outwardly advertise a set of beliefs. Many religions preach that the world will not be at peace until every person is converted to such and such religion. I think you know how I feel about that.
I think I may have read your post in a way that was not intended, but all I'm trying to do here is have a rational discussion about what people on this board believe. This subject is one that I am always pondering and one which I am always open to new ideas.
Well that's enough "smart talk" for now. Off to install my bass blockers.