Bay Area UTEC Owners; input please
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Bay Area UTEC Owners; input please
This a branch off of another thread, "I need a local Tuner".
I'd like to know what the UTEC owners local to the area think about their UTEC. I've been told that UTEC owners get knock due to the UTEC's inability to adjust to changing driving conditions (ie temperature, humidity); as opposed to the Ecutek, which maintains the facotry ecu's ability to adapt to knock.
So, driving around the bay area, have you experienced knocking? I've read Kurleedaddees review on his experiences, but I'm not sure if his is a unique case.
Along with your input, background info on mods, types of map, and genrally driving areas; would hlpe put your comments into perspective.
thanks...
just a lcoal guy trying to figure stuff out for his car.
dan.
I'd like to know what the UTEC owners local to the area think about their UTEC. I've been told that UTEC owners get knock due to the UTEC's inability to adjust to changing driving conditions (ie temperature, humidity); as opposed to the Ecutek, which maintains the facotry ecu's ability to adapt to knock.
So, driving around the bay area, have you experienced knocking? I've read Kurleedaddees review on his experiences, but I'm not sure if his is a unique case.
Along with your input, background info on mods, types of map, and genrally driving areas; would hlpe put your comments into perspective.
thanks...
just a lcoal guy trying to figure stuff out for his car.
dan.
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Here are the experiences of a local i-club member with the UTEC, and his subsequent experience with a ECUTek reflash from i-speed.
http://www.i-speed.us/news/utec_vs_ecutek.shtml
http://www.i-speed.us/news/utec_vs_ecutek.shtml
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I like my utec, but I love fiddling with things. I really like having several maps (that I can create) at my disposal for different situations. I don't think it's the right solution for everybody, but if you're interested in learning tuning (or you're just a huge geek like me and want to be able to play with your car's programming) it's the best!
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I 100% agree with what platypus is saying. I also like having a physical device you can sell and still retain your stock ECU if you want to go back to stock some day. The UTEC also has features that the flashes don't, like launch control and even better yet external solenoid/relay firing and shift light firing. It an ECU enhancement that truly has racing in mind, not just a Ron Popeil Set-It-And-Forget-It add-on. Oh yeah... don't forget, the UTEC flashs the CEL to warn you of knock. AFAIK the Ecutek flash doesn't enable such a feature... how in the heck can Joe Non-tuner Without A DeltaDash know if he's knocking?
I'm figuring that when I am done tuning I will have 4 maps (gee, funny how that just fits in the UTEC). cold ambient freeway, cold ambient street, warm ambient freeway and warm ambient street maps. I'll be running safe and at the exactly desired performance for all conditions. The stock ECU, and maybe even with an Ecutek might be safe... but will it perform to its peak within those bounds? And, just how you want? I dunno about that...
jason
I'm figuring that when I am done tuning I will have 4 maps (gee, funny how that just fits in the UTEC). cold ambient freeway, cold ambient street, warm ambient freeway and warm ambient street maps. I'll be running safe and at the exactly desired performance for all conditions. The stock ECU, and maybe even with an Ecutek might be safe... but will it perform to its peak within those bounds? And, just how you want? I dunno about that...
jason
Last edited by mmboost; Aug 9, 2004 at 09:48 AM.
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From: Longing for my ol' white '02 WRX :(
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Another problem of some USDM WRX's is that many of their ECU's came with conservative maps from the factory. Since the factory map was tuned so conservatively, if a piggyback EMS is put in place, the ECU map they are running underneath is still in a conservative state, and the car will never reach its full potential performance. But if an EcuTeK reflash is performed, the conservative ECU map will be wiped out in favor of the new map, and full potential performance can be achieved.
jason
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The very next day, they start up the car, start to drive it, and under boost, knocking will become apparent in different areas in the map. And this will happen ALL of the time. The car knocks all of the time. So much, that user will no longer have the courage to go WOT with the car for the fear of knocking is there. It feels as if the ECU and the UTEC are having a power struggle over who is in control. And when they are not agreeing with each other, the car begins to knock.
Are you SURE you are not knocking with your Ecutek? How do you know? You must be logging every time you drive, because well... I don't think your Ecutek flashes the CEL to let you know your engine is experiencing knock
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this is in response from the other thread...
The UTEC deffinately has knock detection and it will pull timing and add fuel to combat the knock. What I'm saying, however, is that it does not learn from the knock event. The next time you go through the same RPM spot under the same conditions, it will knock again. Basically, any time the UTEC knocks, its time to whip out the laptop and start tweaking the maps.
With a reflash, if the ECU encounters knock, it will perform the adjustment automatically.... per the tuner's parameters of course. So the next time it encounters the same conditions, the ECU will have compensated to get rid of the knock. What the ECU does and how it does it is all controlled by the tuner of course.
If you think you'll really like tweaking your UTEC maps a good deal and switching maps everytime the weather changes.... think hot day vs. cold night, then go ahead and get a UTEC. Remember, however, what you learn with the UTEC isn't really propper tuning practice that could be applied to anything else but the UTEC.
BTW, I'm the type of person who really likes tweaking things, but I still choose not to use a UTEC because engine management has evolved way past this point and its not something that should be messed with on a regular basis. I also don't want to be switching maps for night time vs a really hot day.
-- Ed
Ed, I thought the new UTEC (i'm speaking of the one for STi) had a Knock Detection thing in it...
am i mistaken?
am i mistaken?
With a reflash, if the ECU encounters knock, it will perform the adjustment automatically.... per the tuner's parameters of course. So the next time it encounters the same conditions, the ECU will have compensated to get rid of the knock. What the ECU does and how it does it is all controlled by the tuner of course.
If you think you'll really like tweaking your UTEC maps a good deal and switching maps everytime the weather changes.... think hot day vs. cold night, then go ahead and get a UTEC. Remember, however, what you learn with the UTEC isn't really propper tuning practice that could be applied to anything else but the UTEC.
BTW, I'm the type of person who really likes tweaking things, but I still choose not to use a UTEC because engine management has evolved way past this point and its not something that should be messed with on a regular basis. I also don't want to be switching maps for night time vs a really hot day.
-- Ed
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Vaus
the problem with the ECU learning is it doesn't learn for performance, it learns for safety. The UTEC lets you decide whats best.
And you are right, enginemanagement has evolved way past this... sure for the daily driver. But that's not what the UTEC is really built for. An Ecutek is nice and safe and easy. I would love to see dyno runs of Ecutek'd WRXs 3 months after a flash and compare numbers. My guess is things would be much smoother and less powerful - all the knock would be tuned out for safety. The knock detected on cold days would turn into lower power on hot days, etc...
Nothing wrong with an Ecutek. I just don't think you can call it a dinosaur. Its just plug-n-play. Show me a winning race team that uses a reflashed ECU (when its not required for their race group
)
jason
the problem with the ECU learning is it doesn't learn for performance, it learns for safety. The UTEC lets you decide whats best.
And you are right, enginemanagement has evolved way past this... sure for the daily driver. But that's not what the UTEC is really built for. An Ecutek is nice and safe and easy. I would love to see dyno runs of Ecutek'd WRXs 3 months after a flash and compare numbers. My guess is things would be much smoother and less powerful - all the knock would be tuned out for safety. The knock detected on cold days would turn into lower power on hot days, etc...
Nothing wrong with an Ecutek. I just don't think you can call it a dinosaur. Its just plug-n-play. Show me a winning race team that uses a reflashed ECU (when its not required for their race group
)jason
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I just ordered a UTEC and the tuner/knock sensor add on thing for my STI and I honestly dont know a thing about it, think I could buy you a sammich one of these days and you can tell me how to get started with this??
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good discussion.
I'm getting to understand the strengths and weakness of both systems. It's funny that the strength of one is the weakness of the other, purely from the perspective of power or reliability being the top priority.
I'm still wondering how the reflash folks deal w/ smog checks?
dan.
I'm getting to understand the strengths and weakness of both systems. It's funny that the strength of one is the weakness of the other, purely from the perspective of power or reliability being the top priority.
I'm still wondering how the reflash folks deal w/ smog checks?
dan.
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You seem to believe that the ECU's learning will only hinder performance. This is simply not true. First of all, a well tuned ECU should knock very rarely... mainly only for bad gas. The ECU can adjust for temperature and atlitude changes without having to rely on the knock learning system. The ECU will also bring timing advance back up once conditions change, so in essence, a well tuned ECU is running the optimal map at all times. How close that optimal map is to the knock threshold is up to the tuner, and the same is true for the UTEC.
-- Ed
-- Ed
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Originally Posted by Krinkov
I just ordered a UTEC and the tuner/knock sensor add on thing for my STI and I honestly dont know a thing about it, think I could buy you a sammich one of these days and you can tell me how to get started with this??
Thanks
-- Ed
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Originally Posted by vaus
Not sure who this was directed at... but if it was me, I'd be glad to help if you're local. Where are you located?
Thanks
-- Ed
Thanks
-- Ed
Im in Santa Rosa but can swing out to Davis no prob, got a friend there I visit often
