What would it take to wake us up?
09-20-2006, 05:57 PM
#1
VIP Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (14)
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Wherever Sucks the Most
Posts: 8,675
Car Info: 2003 WRX, 2008 Camry
What would it take to wake us up?
9/11 seemed to temporarily wake the majority for the time being. Some are still awake... most fell back asleep.
What would it take to really set this country off? NBC attack? What?
Do you think a terrorist organization can handle an attack? Sometimes I think big terror groups only strike when they need to in order keep a full, united, American offensive from crushing their *****. This way some people view them as simply misunderstood (sadly, a lot of lefties) and fall back asleep. Then again, maybe i'm giving these *******s too much credit... they may not have the means to do this and would gladly kill us given the chance.
What would it take to really set this country off? NBC attack? What?
Do you think a terrorist organization can handle an attack? Sometimes I think big terror groups only strike when they need to in order keep a full, united, American offensive from crushing their *****. This way some people view them as simply misunderstood (sadly, a lot of lefties) and fall back asleep. Then again, maybe i'm giving these *******s too much credit... they may not have the means to do this and would gladly kill us given the chance.
Last edited by Salty; 09-20-2006 at 06:11 PM.
09-20-2006, 06:08 PM
#2
VIP Member
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Yokosuka, Japan
Posts: 3,632
Car Info: 2008 EVO X/1991 Nissan Skyline GT-R32
it will need to be something that really effects our everyday lives on all levels. 9/11 killed a lot of people and knocked down a few buildings, but people outside of New York didnt really feel the effect that it had. Not to say it wasnt bad, but unless people get affected personnally it wont ever change.
09-20-2006, 06:31 PM
#3
VIP Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (14)
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Wherever Sucks the Most
Posts: 8,675
Car Info: 2003 WRX, 2008 Camry
I think you're absolutely right.
We should have united even more than we did immediately after 9/11. Instead our Government told us to do the exact opposite by going on with our lives like nothing happened. Made sense at the time because it showed the terrorists that our livelihood could not be effected. Unfortunately that period of time was the only window to actually take a stronger stand than Bush did 2001/2002. Make more organizations to help protect us, stress the fact people need to do more in their community, etc, etc, etc.
But instead people went back to their daily grind as instructed. We went back to our starbucks and steak dinners and are no longer standing on our tippy-toes. And although Bush’s 2003 (and beyond) fiasco helped weaken the bond with the nation faster, I think it was inevitable. It was only one of many catalysts.
I think sustained attacks on everything that involves daily life is the only sure bet to have everyone wake-up. They don’t necessarily have to be big... just the daily attack here and there.
We should have united even more than we did immediately after 9/11. Instead our Government told us to do the exact opposite by going on with our lives like nothing happened. Made sense at the time because it showed the terrorists that our livelihood could not be effected. Unfortunately that period of time was the only window to actually take a stronger stand than Bush did 2001/2002. Make more organizations to help protect us, stress the fact people need to do more in their community, etc, etc, etc.
But instead people went back to their daily grind as instructed. We went back to our starbucks and steak dinners and are no longer standing on our tippy-toes. And although Bush’s 2003 (and beyond) fiasco helped weaken the bond with the nation faster, I think it was inevitable. It was only one of many catalysts.
I think sustained attacks on everything that involves daily life is the only sure bet to have everyone wake-up. They don’t necessarily have to be big... just the daily attack here and there.
09-20-2006, 06:35 PM
#4
Registered User
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: UCIrvine
Posts: 3,312
Car Info: '05 Crystal Grey Metallic WRX Sport Wagon
That other thread with the article would suggest that we're already pleanty prepared, and the only reason we feel vulnerable is because the media and the politicians wish it to be that way for control and profit.
To me it's like owning a nice bike and parking it in a bike rack. You can buy all the locks and gizmos you want, but if someone REALLY REALLY wants your bike, they're gonna take it. We can 'wake up' and instate all the security measures and freedom-limiting legislation we want, but if someone REALLY REALLY wants, they will attack us.
There is hope though. I have a really nice bike...and I park it in a bike rack. But I've spray painted it to look like a piece of crap. So noone WANTS to take it. If we were to have international policies that created a world environment where noone WANTED to attack us...but we've already gone too far down the road of them vs. us to do that at this point...
To me it's like owning a nice bike and parking it in a bike rack. You can buy all the locks and gizmos you want, but if someone REALLY REALLY wants your bike, they're gonna take it. We can 'wake up' and instate all the security measures and freedom-limiting legislation we want, but if someone REALLY REALLY wants, they will attack us.
There is hope though. I have a really nice bike...and I park it in a bike rack. But I've spray painted it to look like a piece of crap. So noone WANTS to take it. If we were to have international policies that created a world environment where noone WANTED to attack us...but we've already gone too far down the road of them vs. us to do that at this point...
09-20-2006, 06:39 PM
#5
VIP Member
Thread Starter
iTrader: (14)
Join Date: May 2003
Location: Wherever Sucks the Most
Posts: 8,675
Car Info: 2003 WRX, 2008 Camry
Interesting view. But I think the ultimate spray-paint would be "Islamic State Red" according to terrorists. A free society cannot have that. But I see your point... we could certainly mind our business more often.
Last edited by Salty; 09-20-2006 at 06:41 PM.
09-20-2006, 09:28 PM
#6
iClub Silver Vendor
iTrader: (25)
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Participating in some Anarchy!
Posts: 15,494
Car Info: 2005 LGT wagon
Originally Posted by MVWRX
If we were to have international policies that created a world environment where noone WANTED to attack us...but we've already gone too far down the road of them vs. us to do that at this point...
It almost sounds like you're saying we deserved to be attacked...am I wrong?
There will always be countries and/or leaders that will blame the USA for their problems, no matter what our foreign policies may be.
Why?
1. Convenience. It's far more convenient to blame others for your problems. Why blame your backward religious beliefs or political failings for causing a 4th world country when the USA is a mere 10,000 miles away?
2. Internal Support. Amongst us, there are some that will agree/support our distractor(s). Sandy Sheehan meets with Hugo Chavez on his tv show, proclaiming that Bush is the greatest terrorist threat to the world.
Hell, need I say more than "Jimmy Carter"?
3. Jealousy. The USA is a wonderful place to live. 11tybillion illegals can't be wrong! Face it, if the economy didn't depend on petroleum, no one would give two ****s about 2/3rds of the world. Why? Because OPEC countries would have nothing to offer the World Community. And w/out petrol profits, those same countries would still be living like they did during the crusades.
Maybe I got it all wrong and the USA really does suxoRs....but I doubt it.
09-21-2006, 02:47 AM
#7
Registered User
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: UCIrvine
Posts: 3,312
Car Info: '05 Crystal Grey Metallic WRX Sport Wagon
It isn't about the US being 'teh suxors' or whatever the lingo is now. It's about the US no longer trying to spread our way of living to everyone on the globe (our way of living meaning: self susataining rule by the masses that actually live life day to day).
We used to pride ouselves on being the country that exemplified the way humanity can sustain itself in a truley democratic way, but now we pride ouseleves on spreading our current government's opinion by force and military might. Do I really need to remind you all that we started as a country who had NO (relative) military might? The reason we ARE a country is because our founders appealed to the majority of human kind on the basis that our (still untried at the time) system would secure the rights of every person.
Unfortunatly, we are now wittnessing a time when logic and the persuit of equality has been long abandoned. We now are preoccupied with the pursuit of power and the sustainment of our own 'way of life'. The few dozen people who founded our country would be proud that we have dominated the planet; yet they would be ashamed that we have so mishandled the wellbeing of all people that, I believe, they would have second-guessed their actions in relation to their motives.
Don't get me wrong, I very much appreciate the life I have been given as an American born citizen...but I question weather or not we are really living up to the example of above-average humanism that lead to our country's beginning.
We used to pride ouselves on being the country that exemplified the way humanity can sustain itself in a truley democratic way, but now we pride ouseleves on spreading our current government's opinion by force and military might. Do I really need to remind you all that we started as a country who had NO (relative) military might? The reason we ARE a country is because our founders appealed to the majority of human kind on the basis that our (still untried at the time) system would secure the rights of every person.
Unfortunatly, we are now wittnessing a time when logic and the persuit of equality has been long abandoned. We now are preoccupied with the pursuit of power and the sustainment of our own 'way of life'. The few dozen people who founded our country would be proud that we have dominated the planet; yet they would be ashamed that we have so mishandled the wellbeing of all people that, I believe, they would have second-guessed their actions in relation to their motives.
Don't get me wrong, I very much appreciate the life I have been given as an American born citizen...but I question weather or not we are really living up to the example of above-average humanism that lead to our country's beginning.
Last edited by MVWRX; 09-21-2006 at 02:57 AM.
09-21-2006, 02:55 AM
#8
Registered User
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Aug 2004
Location: UCIrvine
Posts: 3,312
Car Info: '05 Crystal Grey Metallic WRX Sport Wagon
How could our policies be different??!?!
Oh, I don't know...maybe not attacking a country that had NO PROVEN AFFILIATION TO THE GROUP THAT ATTACKED US!!!!
The burden of proof is on the retaliator. We said HEY YOU DID US WRONG...when, in truth, they didn't. We've done this before, and now we've done it enough times that the world's people don't trust that we act in the common good of the average human. That's really ashame, since we started out with such good intentions for the average human.
But hey, if your goal is the domination of the planet (for however short a time we may have) then maybe we're on the right track. Do we want to give up our global domination to another 'power', or do we want to give up our domination to a global wellbeing...I could have sworn we all wanted human beings to survive for longer than cockroaches, but I guess our goal was to 'get the getting while the getting is good'...
Oh, I don't know...maybe not attacking a country that had NO PROVEN AFFILIATION TO THE GROUP THAT ATTACKED US!!!!
The burden of proof is on the retaliator. We said HEY YOU DID US WRONG...when, in truth, they didn't. We've done this before, and now we've done it enough times that the world's people don't trust that we act in the common good of the average human. That's really ashame, since we started out with such good intentions for the average human.
But hey, if your goal is the domination of the planet (for however short a time we may have) then maybe we're on the right track. Do we want to give up our global domination to another 'power', or do we want to give up our domination to a global wellbeing...I could have sworn we all wanted human beings to survive for longer than cockroaches, but I guess our goal was to 'get the getting while the getting is good'...
Last edited by MVWRX; 09-21-2006 at 02:58 AM.
09-21-2006, 10:53 AM
#9
Registered User
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: "It will take time to restore chaos." GWB
Posts: 3,461
Car Info: 72 Vespa with curb feelers
Originally Posted by MVWRX
How could our policies be different??!?!
Oh, I don't know...maybe not attacking a country that had NO PROVEN AFFILIATION TO THE GROUP THAT ATTACKED US!!!!
Oh, I don't know...maybe not attacking a country that had NO PROVEN AFFILIATION TO THE GROUP THAT ATTACKED US!!!!
Now you're the first to say the U.S. is power hungry, but does that mean we leave or stay in Iraq? How about Thailand where human rights and freedom of speech are being squelched? Do you want "the old righteous" U.S. to free the people of Thailand? I thought not.
Take a good look in the mirror, because the person you've become is brainwashed and bigoted against his own country.
09-21-2006, 10:58 AM
#10
Originally Posted by 06WRX4ME
it will need to be something that really effects our everyday lives on all levels. 9/11 killed a lot of people and knocked down a few buildings, but people outside of New York didnt really feel the effect that it had. Not to say it wasnt bad, but unless people get affected personnally it wont ever change.
But I do agree that people to the West of New York were not as affected. But after being in PA for the past 3 years it's begun to affect me more by being around those that were directly involved. One of my roommate's my soph year was downtown when it happened. Crazy to hear his story.
09-21-2006, 12:23 PM
#11
VIP Member
iTrader: (4)
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Yokosuka, Japan
Posts: 3,632
Car Info: 2008 EVO X/1991 Nissan Skyline GT-R32
Originally Posted by jvick125
Yeah, I don't remember the stock market falling quite substantially and watching my college savings drop by 50%.
But I do agree that people to the West of New York were not as affected. But after being in PA for the past 3 years it's begun to affect me more by being around those that were directly involved. One of my roommate's my soph year was downtown when it happened. Crazy to hear his story.
But I do agree that people to the West of New York were not as affected. But after being in PA for the past 3 years it's begun to affect me more by being around those that were directly involved. One of my roommate's my soph year was downtown when it happened. Crazy to hear his story.
I do understand the financial loss that was taken, but what percent of the US has stock investments?
09-21-2006, 03:53 PM
#12
iClub Silver Vendor
iTrader: (25)
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Participating in some Anarchy!
Posts: 15,494
Car Info: 2005 LGT wagon
Originally Posted by MVWRX
How could our policies be different??!?!
Oh, I don't know...maybe not attacking a country that had NO PROVEN AFFILIATION TO THE GROUP THAT ATTACKED US!!!!
The burden of proof is on the retaliator. We said HEY YOU DID US WRONG...when, in truth, they didn't. We've done this before, and now we've done it enough times that the world's people don't trust that we act in the common good of the average human. That's really ashame, since we started out with such good intentions for the average human.
But hey, if your goal is the domination of the planet (for however short a time we may have) then maybe we're on the right track. Do we want to give up our global domination to another 'power', or do we want to give up our domination to a global wellbeing...I could have sworn we all wanted human beings to survive for longer than cockroaches, but I guess our goal was to 'get the getting while the getting is good'...
Oh, I don't know...maybe not attacking a country that had NO PROVEN AFFILIATION TO THE GROUP THAT ATTACKED US!!!!
The burden of proof is on the retaliator. We said HEY YOU DID US WRONG...when, in truth, they didn't. We've done this before, and now we've done it enough times that the world's people don't trust that we act in the common good of the average human. That's really ashame, since we started out with such good intentions for the average human.
But hey, if your goal is the domination of the planet (for however short a time we may have) then maybe we're on the right track. Do we want to give up our global domination to another 'power', or do we want to give up our domination to a global wellbeing...I could have sworn we all wanted human beings to survive for longer than cockroaches, but I guess our goal was to 'get the getting while the getting is good'...
How did our policies on/before 9/10 justify 9/11?
How many times has the pope called for a jihad in the last 200yrs?
What did we, as Americans, do to deserve the Twin Towers attack?
Yes, I want the human species to survive.
But if some humans are a threat to the rest of the species, shouldn't they be removed?
09-21-2006, 05:26 PM
#13
Registered User
iTrader: (2)
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Mountains
Posts: 4,650
Car Info: 2007 Nissan Frontier
Salty, in response to your origional question, I ask: Wake us up to what? The threat of terrorism, and that zomg people want to kill us? I believe that the public realizes that, and continues to carry on buisness as usual for a reason. The threat to you or I really is not that great. So what would "waking up the public" do besides drive fear do, besides lead to hasty un-thoughtout descisions and a unconfidant public (which we have seen many times before leads to a downturn in the economy)? We have seen from the Iraq debacle that time is needed to make the correct descisions.
I realize the thread has taken another turn, I'm just curious. *shrugs*
-Jeff
I realize the thread has taken another turn, I'm just curious. *shrugs*
-Jeff
09-21-2006, 06:25 PM
#14
Originally Posted by 06WRX4ME
I do understand the financial loss that was taken, but what percent of the US has stock investments?
Ps: It hit more than just stocks. Commodities (your food) were also hit, among many others.
09-21-2006, 09:15 PM
#15
Registered User
iTrader: (2)
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Mountains
Posts: 4,650
Car Info: 2007 Nissan Frontier
Originally Posted by jvick125
Yeah, I don't remember the stock market falling quite substantially and watching my college savings drop by 50%.
.