Against illegal immigration?
11-06-2005, 08:07 PM
#76
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Originally Posted by Matth3w
fortunately for you, i dont mind re-iterating one last time for slow learners:
1) From 1925-1965 before the ridiculous immigration laws were implemented, the US actually had a net immigration OUT of the country. from 1787 - 1965 we had people to run our farms, we will have them after the ILLEGAL mexicans are deported as well.
2) your vegetables will not go up but 2-3% if all the illegals are gone. so from like 69 cents a lb to 72ish cents.
3) people will work for the farms, but they will demand proper wages. this wont raise prices significantly because the people hiring illegals are adding to their profit margins, not to your bottom line price. since there ARE companies that DONT commit federal offenses, they will be forced to keep their prices approximately the same to compete.
4) your friends, the illegals, are not tested for any infectious diseases unlike legal immigrants. so your friends are picking your veggies even though there are plenty of medical proof that mexicans who come here illegally are bringing diseases like TB and other things that arent a problem for the US anymore.
5) there were 5.2 million jobs taken by illegals that were not reported by US citizens and legal residents. im not saying that people would take all 5.2 million but i can assure you that when it gets to a certain point people will take the jobs. they have been for hundreds of years and it will continue after the illegal mexicans are gone.
6) illegals, if you read my site, create a problem of 10 billion per year for our country. this is BECAUSE they work for these farms illegally etc, but still use health benefits, welfare, etc, not DESPITE it. so they temporarily fill a job illegally while costing us 10 billion dollars. what a benefit.
7) once again, since you dont seem to comprehend well - i am against only illegal immigration.
8) i see that you are completely in favor of these idiot companies committing felonies and mistreating its workers (the illegals). so do you also support sweat shops, slaves, and child labor so long as it does a job that YOU wouldnt do?
1) From 1925-1965 before the ridiculous immigration laws were implemented, the US actually had a net immigration OUT of the country. from 1787 - 1965 we had people to run our farms, we will have them after the ILLEGAL mexicans are deported as well.
2) your vegetables will not go up but 2-3% if all the illegals are gone. so from like 69 cents a lb to 72ish cents.
3) people will work for the farms, but they will demand proper wages. this wont raise prices significantly because the people hiring illegals are adding to their profit margins, not to your bottom line price. since there ARE companies that DONT commit federal offenses, they will be forced to keep their prices approximately the same to compete.
4) your friends, the illegals, are not tested for any infectious diseases unlike legal immigrants. so your friends are picking your veggies even though there are plenty of medical proof that mexicans who come here illegally are bringing diseases like TB and other things that arent a problem for the US anymore.
5) there were 5.2 million jobs taken by illegals that were not reported by US citizens and legal residents. im not saying that people would take all 5.2 million but i can assure you that when it gets to a certain point people will take the jobs. they have been for hundreds of years and it will continue after the illegal mexicans are gone.
6) illegals, if you read my site, create a problem of 10 billion per year for our country. this is BECAUSE they work for these farms illegally etc, but still use health benefits, welfare, etc, not DESPITE it. so they temporarily fill a job illegally while costing us 10 billion dollars. what a benefit.
7) once again, since you dont seem to comprehend well - i am against only illegal immigration.
8) i see that you are completely in favor of these idiot companies committing felonies and mistreating its workers (the illegals). so do you also support sweat shops, slaves, and child labor so long as it does a job that YOU wouldnt do?
11-07-2005, 05:51 AM
#79
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So what is your solution?? You claim that veggies will only go up slightly. That's great. If you dont think everything else will shoot through the roof you clearly havent worked in many service sectors. Here are other ramifications (to name a few):
- a glut of lower-end restaurant workers
- a glut of maids, maintenance repairmen, bussers in the hotel industry
- a glut of qualified manual laborers for constrcution
These are just a few sectors that would be adversely affected. The numbers you try to cite for this wouldnt be accurate as there is really no telling how many illegals are employed in hotels, restaurants, and on construction sites.
You pull out that labor, and you would be paying double for food eaten at restaurants, would be paying double at your favorite hotel, and, yes, would be paying double for your nice little cookie cutter tract home in the valley.
- a glut of lower-end restaurant workers
- a glut of maids, maintenance repairmen, bussers in the hotel industry
- a glut of qualified manual laborers for constrcution
These are just a few sectors that would be adversely affected. The numbers you try to cite for this wouldnt be accurate as there is really no telling how many illegals are employed in hotels, restaurants, and on construction sites.
You pull out that labor, and you would be paying double for food eaten at restaurants, would be paying double at your favorite hotel, and, yes, would be paying double for your nice little cookie cutter tract home in the valley.
11-07-2005, 06:21 AM
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Originally Posted by Matth3w
i know this was hard to miss (rolls eyes)
Originally Posted by Imprezastifan88
Wait for tommorow: i have better things to do with my weekend than argue on teh intr4w3b 
11-07-2005, 07:44 AM
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Originally Posted by Oaf
You racist mother****er.
Oh, and you're ignorant, too.
Oh, and you're ignorant, too.
I'm racist huh? First off, I happen to be half Mexican, maybe you think I'm racist towards whites?<---that would be pretty stupid considering the other half of me is Irish. I have no idea what you are talking about......
A little side note, California used to be Mexico, hence all the hispanic names for our communities.....Los Angeles, San Francisco, San Diego, Jesus almost everything in California or the southwestern US is named after something Hispanic.....or haven't you dumb f*cks noticed that yet.....so with that being said, maybe we should have more respect for our neighbors to the south, considering this used to be their home.
Last edited by case1; 11-07-2005 at 07:59 AM.
11-07-2005, 07:53 AM
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I don't have much time becasue i have to work, but I will point out what I think is the fundamental flaw in your arguement, which Dub2w pointed out.
We have been focusing so much on the agriculture industry, but that is not the only area that would hurt from the loss of cheap labor. Hotels, resutrants, construction. You say americans will take these jobs but will they? You can give them comparable wages, but there are other things you have to take into consideration like presitige. Are you going to want to take a entry level job, if your family has been living a middle class life?
-Jeff
*more later, i just dont have time now*
We have been focusing so much on the agriculture industry, but that is not the only area that would hurt from the loss of cheap labor. Hotels, resutrants, construction. You say americans will take these jobs but will they? You can give them comparable wages, but there are other things you have to take into consideration like presitige. Are you going to want to take a entry level job, if your family has been living a middle class life?
-Jeff
*more later, i just dont have time now*
11-07-2005, 08:31 PM
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Originally Posted by Imprezastifan88
I don't have much time becasue i have to work, but I will point out what I think is the fundamental flaw in your arguement, which Dub2w pointed out.
We have been focusing so much on the agriculture industry, but that is not the only area that would hurt from the loss of cheap labor. Hotels, resutrants, construction. You say americans will take these jobs but will they? You can give them comparable wages, but there are other things you have to take into consideration like presitige. Are you going to want to take a entry level job, if your family has been living a middle class life?
-Jeff
*more later, i just dont have time now*
We have been focusing so much on the agriculture industry, but that is not the only area that would hurt from the loss of cheap labor. Hotels, resutrants, construction. You say americans will take these jobs but will they? You can give them comparable wages, but there are other things you have to take into consideration like presitige. Are you going to want to take a entry level job, if your family has been living a middle class life?
-Jeff
*more later, i just dont have time now*
11-07-2005, 09:19 PM
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Originally Posted by Imprezastifan88
Also, just wondering, did a illegal kill your family or something? Because you definately seem to hate these people more than anyone I have ever met (including my extremist congressman Tom Tancrado... west side denver is dumb). I mean did you lose a job because of them?
You may shake your head at me, but my point still stands and you have not adressed it. Where the hell are the workers going to come from to fill these spots!? I may sound stuck-up right now, but you and I both know its true. Even people who are going into entry level jobs right now are going for things higher than dish-washer or maid, even if there are comparable wages. Consider this: you come from a working-class family, dad works in a factory for all his life. You graduate high school and tell him "hey dad, I'm going to go get a dead-end job at a hotel cleaning peoples **** up! Arn't you excited for me!"
And then, I'm sure you will reply, "well you are abusing these people" but we really are not. They are following the same path that our grandfathers and great grandfathers did. Start low, work on up. Even if they end up working 3 jobs all their life getting nowhere, the next generation has more opprotunity because education is now availible. This generation works hard and gains a lower middle class lifestyle, and enstills a hard work ethic in their children who get good grades and maybe even go to college. Of course this is the ideal, but it happens a lot.
And "they send money back to mexico" well I say good for them. They are supporting their families instead of supporting the greed and glutony that is corporate america. And of course here you will say "liberal anarchist, or pinko-commie" or something of that sorts, but once again you are wrong. I work for a major corporation and am damn happy with my job, and am very pro-buisness. Hypocratic? Somewhat, but I am only against the corruption and poilitical meddling that happens behind closed doors with many of the major corporations right now. For me, the immigration is a opprotunity. People who will work hard, for less than a lazy american, and will be happy doing their job because it is more money than they could dream of making in Mexico. They also have the ability to think on their own, something that seems to have been lost long ago by many americans. They crossed the boarder illegally, woo-freaking-doo. It is our fault that we let so many come through, and we should pay the concequences, not them. They siezed a opprotunity and good for them for doing it.
Another thing I hear coming up is the "destruction of our culture". What culture? What they are doing is adding to the very culture this country was founded upon, a culture of immigrants, a melting pot. Hell, the southwest used to BE mexico! I, as well as most people I know enjoy all the new mexican resturants that have appeared all over Denver (many of which are owned by illegals, i know because a friend owns one and he is a illegal). I enjoy the culutral shift to a more southwest feel, and I laugh when i see a lowrider packed with people crusing down Federal Bvld.
So in conclusion, what do I propose?
1. Do not kick out any current illegals unless they commit a felony.
2. Allow current illegals to become American citizens *gasp* through a specialized process developed for them that is rigorous but not impossible.
3. Strengthen our boarders, and erect fences and more patrols (agree with you on this one)
4. Allow pathways for Latin Americans to come to our country that are not for only the wealthy and are realistic.
-Jeff
11-07-2005, 09:21 PM
#86
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Originally Posted by case1
what the f*ck?
I'm racist huh? First off, I happen to be half Mexican, maybe you think I'm racist towards whites?<---that would be pretty stupid considering the other half of me is Irish. I have no idea what you are talking about......
A little side note, California used to be Mexico, hence all the hispanic names for our communities.....Los Angeles, San Francisco, San Diego, Jesus almost everything in California or the southwestern US is named after something Hispanic.....or haven't you dumb f*cks noticed that yet.....so with that being said, maybe we should have more respect for our neighbors to the south, considering this used to be their home.
I'm racist huh? First off, I happen to be half Mexican, maybe you think I'm racist towards whites?<---that would be pretty stupid considering the other half of me is Irish. I have no idea what you are talking about......
A little side note, California used to be Mexico, hence all the hispanic names for our communities.....Los Angeles, San Francisco, San Diego, Jesus almost everything in California or the southwestern US is named after something Hispanic.....or haven't you dumb f*cks noticed that yet.....so with that being said, maybe we should have more respect for our neighbors to the south, considering this used to be their home.
You're statment was overtly racist.
Let's play around with your statement and see if you get the point:
1. It'll be a cold day in hell before any black person is seen working.
2. It'll be a cold day in hell before any Irish Mick is seen not drinking.
3. It'll be a cold day in hell before any Mexican person is seen not stealing hubcaps.
Before welfare as we know it was with us, you'd see plenty of whites and, get this,....blacks picking produce.
And as far as California once being part of Mexico, the key word would be used to.
We fought a war & won it fair and square.
Well, actually, Mexico kinda kick our *** & then sold CA off, but why trouble with the details.
Oh, and btw, how the **** do explain towns like Fort Ross, Sebastopol, Bakersfield?!
OK, maybe those aren't the best examples of non-Mexican influenced names, but you get the idea.
Last edited by FW Motorsports; 11-07-2005 at 09:24 PM.
11-07-2005, 09:29 PM
#87
Imprezastifan88: I'm not gonna quote your post because it's much too long. But I agree with basically everything you said. Although, the only thing that I SORT OF disagree on is that the amount of money they send to Mexico should be limited. How they would regulate that? I have NO idea.
Two Mexican guys work for my dad on our farm, and they've worked there for over 30 years if I remember correctly. One originally came as an illegal, but my dad helped him get his citizenship back in the 70's. Both these guys send a fair amount of their paycheck to their parents and the rest of their family in Mexico. I think that's great, I know I would do the same if I were in their situation. BUT, I think that that amount of money should be regulated some how.
Two Mexican guys work for my dad on our farm, and they've worked there for over 30 years if I remember correctly. One originally came as an illegal, but my dad helped him get his citizenship back in the 70's. Both these guys send a fair amount of their paycheck to their parents and the rest of their family in Mexico. I think that's great, I know I would do the same if I were in their situation. BUT, I think that that amount of money should be regulated some how.
11-07-2005, 09:29 PM
#88
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And another point while I have time I frogot to point out.
WTF is up with this whole paranoia that our nation has right now? It is not like all of these people are coming to eat your babies and rape your mothers. They are regular people. Sure there are a few bad berries in the bunch, but we have a few bad berries ourselves.
WTF is up with this whole paranoia that our nation has right now? It is not like all of these people are coming to eat your babies and rape your mothers. They are regular people. Sure there are a few bad berries in the bunch, but we have a few bad berries ourselves.
11-07-2005, 09:30 PM
#89
Originally Posted by Imprezastifan88
And another point while I have time I frogot to point out.
WTF is up with this whole paranoia that our nation has right now? It is not like all of these people are coming to eat your babies and rape your mothers. They are regular people. Sure there are a few bad berries in the bunch, but we have a few bad berries ourselves.
WTF is up with this whole paranoia that our nation has right now? It is not like all of these people are coming to eat your babies and rape your mothers. They are regular people. Sure there are a few bad berries in the bunch, but we have a few bad berries ourselves.
11-07-2005, 09:31 PM
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Originally Posted by jvick125
Imprezastifan88: I'm not gonna quote your post because it's much too long. But I agree with basically everything you said. Although, the only thing that I SORT OF disagree on is that the amount of money they send to Mexico should be limited. How they would regulate that? I have NO idea.
Two Mexican guys work for my dad on our farm, and they've worked there for over 30 years if I remember correctly. One originally came as an illegal, but my dad helped him get his citizenship back in the 70's. Both these guys send a fair amount of their paycheck to their parents and the rest of their family in Mexico. I think that's great, I know I would do the same if I were in their situation. BUT, I think that that amount of money should be regulated some how.
Two Mexican guys work for my dad on our farm, and they've worked there for over 30 years if I remember correctly. One originally came as an illegal, but my dad helped him get his citizenship back in the 70's. Both these guys send a fair amount of their paycheck to their parents and the rest of their family in Mexico. I think that's great, I know I would do the same if I were in their situation. BUT, I think that that amount of money should be regulated some how.