5,500 soldiers have deserted Iraq.
01-14-2005, 06:25 AM
#1
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5,500 soldiers have deserted Iraq.
"The Pentagon says more than 5,500 servicemen have deserted since the war started in Iraq. "
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/mai...9/ixportal.html
Kind of goes against the Bush sack riders claims that we have an all volunteer army and that all of the soldiers are behind the war effort doesn't it?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/mai...9/ixportal.html
Kind of goes against the Bush sack riders claims that we have an all volunteer army and that all of the soldiers are behind the war effort doesn't it?
01-14-2005, 08:46 AM
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I think that they never thought that they'd ever get deployed. Or at least were hoping that they wouldn't. They probably joined just for the college money and had no intention of ever really serving thier contry. Bunch of panzies. The military is better off without them. So is America.
01-14-2005, 01:41 PM
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Originally Posted by Ceej
"The Pentagon says more than 5,500 servicemen have deserted since the war started in Iraq. "
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/mai...9/ixportal.html
Kind of goes against the Bush sack riders claims that we have an all volunteer army and that all of the soldiers are behind the war effort doesn't it?
http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/mai...9/ixportal.html
Kind of goes against the Bush sack riders claims that we have an all volunteer army and that all of the soldiers are behind the war effort doesn't it?
01-14-2005, 02:44 PM
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Originally Posted by deyes
We do have an all volunteer army, and who said all of the soldiers are behind the war effort? What distinguishes them from the rest of the country in regards to being behind the war effort? I wonder how that number compares to other confilcts we have been involved in? Why has this not been an issue of note in other wars? Because people don't like Bush more than other presidents?
Don't know the total number in uniform during that time, but it's safe to assume many times more than now.
Meaning, expressed as a percentage of deserters/those serving, we have more deserting now than during WW2.
**EDIT**
16.1 million served during WW2.
1.5 million as of Oct 2004.
WW2: 20,000/16,100,000 = .12%
Iraq: 5,500/1,500,000 = .37%
So, assuming the 5500 figure is correct, there are 3X as many deserting now then during WW2.
Last edited by FW Motorsports; 01-14-2005 at 02:58 PM.
01-14-2005, 04:08 PM
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Wow good way at looking at it Oaf. Maybe they just don't think dying for oil is why the signed up for. Shrug.
01-14-2005, 04:15 PM
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Originally Posted by Oaf
I remember reading something like 20,000 deserters in WW2, all happening in the ETO.
Don't know the total number in uniform during that time, but it's safe to assume many times more than now.
Meaning, expressed as a percentage of deserters/those serving, we have more deserting now than during WW2.
**EDIT**
16.1 million served during WW2.
1.5 million as of Oct 2004.
WW2: 20,000/16,100,000 = .12%
Iraq: 5,500/1,500,000 = .37%
So, assuming the 5500 figure is correct, there are 3X as many deserting now then during WW2.
Don't know the total number in uniform during that time, but it's safe to assume many times more than now.
Meaning, expressed as a percentage of deserters/those serving, we have more deserting now than during WW2.
**EDIT**
16.1 million served during WW2.
1.5 million as of Oct 2004.
WW2: 20,000/16,100,000 = .12%
Iraq: 5,500/1,500,000 = .37%
So, assuming the 5500 figure is correct, there are 3X as many deserting now then during WW2.
Not a very good comparison. It think Vietnam would be a better comparison. WW2 enjoyed near unanimous support. Whereas Vietnam like Iraq has had vocal widespread national opposition in political circles as well as the press.
01-14-2005, 04:23 PM
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Proably worse in Vietnam then...Shrug still a intresting way at looking at it.
01-14-2005, 04:33 PM
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In my mind it would be a reasonable question to ask why are we fighting in Iraq, why are we fighting in Vietnam? I think very few that were faced with the prospect of serving our country in WWII had any such reservations. At least none of the verterans I have had the honor of speaking with.
01-14-2005, 07:17 PM
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Its a unique way at looking at it but when you even try to compare the two, Vietnam and Iraq, a lot of people get up in arms about it.
01-14-2005, 07:26 PM
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Originally Posted by Oaf
I remember reading something like 20,000 deserters in WW2, all happening in the ETO.
Don't know the total number in uniform during that time, but it's safe to assume many times more than now.
Meaning, expressed as a percentage of deserters/those serving, we have more deserting now than during WW2.
**EDIT**
16.1 million served during WW2.
1.5 million as of Oct 2004.
WW2: 20,000/16,100,000 = .12%
Iraq: 5,500/1,500,000 = .37%
So, assuming the 5500 figure is correct, there are 3X as many deserting now then during WW2.
Don't know the total number in uniform during that time, but it's safe to assume many times more than now.
Meaning, expressed as a percentage of deserters/those serving, we have more deserting now than during WW2.
**EDIT**
16.1 million served during WW2.
1.5 million as of Oct 2004.
WW2: 20,000/16,100,000 = .12%
Iraq: 5,500/1,500,000 = .37%
So, assuming the 5500 figure is correct, there are 3X as many deserting now then during WW2.
01-14-2005, 07:27 PM
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Originally Posted by deyes
Not a very good comparison. It think Vietnam would be a better comparison. WW2 enjoyed near unanimous support. Whereas Vietnam like Iraq has had vocal widespread national opposition in political circles as well as the press.
01-14-2005, 11:28 PM
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First off, one has to consider that the British military did/still does have a different definition of desertion; in the US, it's being AWOL > 30 days.
The reason I used WW2 data was that most people, except for maybe psoper, feel that WW2 was the last "good" war.
It's also interesting to note that all of the US desertions of that war happened in Europe and not in the Pacific Theater of Operations (PTO).
I suspect that our troops couldn't blend in with the locals in the PTO, while they could in the ETO.
That being said, I seriously question the 5500 figure for the current Iraq operation...wouldn't you be seeing more blindfolded troops being video-taped by the bad guys?
Anyway, what is the "normal" rate of desertion for the US military?
I know we had what I considered quite a few guys "go over the wall" before Iraq invaded Kuwait, but none after the invasion.
The reason I used WW2 data was that most people, except for maybe psoper, feel that WW2 was the last "good" war.
It's also interesting to note that all of the US desertions of that war happened in Europe and not in the Pacific Theater of Operations (PTO).
I suspect that our troops couldn't blend in with the locals in the PTO, while they could in the ETO.
That being said, I seriously question the 5500 figure for the current Iraq operation...wouldn't you be seeing more blindfolded troops being video-taped by the bad guys?
Anyway, what is the "normal" rate of desertion for the US military?
I know we had what I considered quite a few guys "go over the wall" before Iraq invaded Kuwait, but none after the invasion.
01-15-2005, 01:14 AM
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