I understand that it can be difficult to find a place where you can perform this procedure without drawing unwanted attention, especially if you live in an urban setting like you mentioned. The reason we set up the procedure the way we did was because it gives us us a certain amount of control over the amount of energy and the rate at which that energy is transferred into heat and absorbed by the rotors.

This isn't rocket science by any means, but the process can be screwed up so there is a method behind the madness is really the point I'm trying to make. The best suggestion I can make is to make some time on a weekend to find an isolated, private road outside of the city where you can go break the pads in. If that's out of the question, Ultimate may not be the pad for you. If you do most of your driving in the inner city, you're likely not reaching the kind of speeds where you will be able to put the MOT of Ultimate to good use. Something like Hawk HPS may be more suited to your particular application; just something to think about.

Tim Kelsch
StopTech LLC

 

Many pads out there will hinder cold or hot performance, cause excessive (sometimes acidic) dust, be more prone to squeal like a pig, and will likely eat your rotors.

Pads and rotors will not affect the feel unless you have a glazing problem.

Brake pads have advantages and trade-offs, and the OEM pad is excellent for just about everything. I worked in the industry, so I know a bit.

If you simply want to spend money, go for it =).

 

HD, did you read any of the responses to this thread before you wrote that?

 

HellaDumb, I assume that you meant, "Pads and rotors do not affect the feel [of the brake system]" If that is an incorrect assumption, then I reserve the right to withdraw the following statements.

The above statement is not true. Different friction materials can have radically different mu vs. temperature, mu vs. pressure, and mu vs. rotor speed graphs. Furthermore, different friction materials can have radically different release characteristics, initial bite, and changes in brake torque throughout a given deceleration with applied pressure being held constant. Some of these properties can be easily indicated on a dyno plot, however others are more difficult to distinguish.

The fact of the matter is that the widely ranging friction characteristics and torque outputs of different friction materials results in widely varied pedal pressure inputs to achieve a given level of deceleration. It is that variance in pedal pressure, in a physical sense, that explains how different friction materials can affect how a person perceives how the brake system "feels."

Different rotor finishes (slotting, drilling, etc) also significantly affects the torque output of a given friction material, so it is also true that changes in rotor finish can affect the "feel" of the brake system.

Tim Kelsch
StopTech LLC

PS - Nice avatar Kev. Knopfler rules.

 

To drastically over-simplify what I meant, when "most people" talk about "feel," they are looking to get rid of a squishy pedal.

Simply adding pads alone (or with rotors) that improve the coefficient of friction known as "bite" will not give you a firm pedal. There are other solutions that specifically adress "feel" on Subarus, such as Master Cylinder braces, brake lines, and different fluids... all which complement your product.

I'm simply attempting to disbunk the notion that OEM parts are crap. IMO, the OEM WRX pad work excellent, are actually a "better" product than many of the replacement options.

 

Skimmed it. I don't retain absolute B.S. =)

 

I read the Politics forum. You retain plenty of BS. Try to leave it there.

 

*ducks under chair and wonders how his thread went out of control*

Oh man, now all we need is one of the Brembo guys posting here, and prompting a 1500-word dissertation from Razor again

 

I like it when that happens. Tim yells at me for making more work for him though.

 

Ohhh!

 

I'm bumping this ancient topic because I am finally ready to buy... the problem that I am having is that none of the "stage" packages out there (SubyDude, StopTech, Gruppe-S) has the parts or pads I want. I'm sold on the StopTech slotted rotors, but I still can't decide on pads (Hawk? Bobcats? Axxis?) and I'm not certain I need to spend the money to get and install stainless steel lines, as the car will never see actual track time. My goal is to ditch my U G L Y rusted stock rotors and my 50% gone stock pads and get a more positive brake feel and reduced stopping distance...

So, for street pads, Axxis or Bobcats? Lines or no lines? Other rotor options?

I'm still trying to figure out how I am going to get front/rear StopTech OEM-size rotors for $200, BAN

 

Uh, you don't. that's what fronts cost. Yuo don't really need rears until your stockers are worn out, which won't be anytime soon.

 

As per usual, BS is correct on both points. (heh, I can't believe it took me this long to figure out that his initials are BS)

Putting my brake dork hat on, to address meilers's goals of:
1. Ditch my U G L Y rusted stock rotors
2. Ditch my 50% gone stock pads
3. Get a more positive brake feel
4. Reduce stopping distance

1. Taken care of with StopTech direct replacement rotors.
2. Need more info regarding what you're looking for in a pad.
3. Here is a list of mods you can do to improve brake feel, in order of least to greatest increase in feel per dollar:
Flush and bleed fluid
Install front and rear SS Lines
Install front and rear pads that have a higher coefficient of friction
Install slotted front and rear rotors
Install stiffer calipers

Although stiffer calipers come last in terms of value, the amount of increase in pedal feel gained is second only to bleeding a system that has air in it. Brembo shills love to attempt to downplay the importance of caliper stiffness, but anyone who has driven a StopTech system back to back with a Brembo system will tell you that it is significant. Sorry to get off on that tangent, just wanted to be clear on what I was saying.

Anywho, if you can give me more information in terms of what you're looking for in terms of a brake pad, I can help you choose one that fits your needs.

Thanks,
Tim Kelsch
StopTech LLC

 

Razor,

I'm the one who started the thread, and you already gave me an excellent pad comparison a dozen or so posts back. I'm just curious as to how the Bobcats compare, and whether I should bother with steel brake lines -- do they have maintenence issues as compared to stock? How much of my factory warranty will be affected (i.e. master cylinder, parking brake etc.) will I void by upgrading?

 

Yeah, I was just yanking your chain . I'm definitely aware that my stock rear rotors do not need to be changed out -- I am partially doing this upgrade for *gasp* cosmetic reasons, honestly. I know that seems irrational, but after I spent all this money on 17" wheels and tires, the first thing I see when I look at my car is the nasty orange color of my rotor hubs -- they are entirely rusted, worse than I've seen on any other Japanese car.