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endlinks

Old May 8, 2003 | 11:04 AM
  #2  
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The endlinks are replaced because the stock ones are plastic. If you put a larger sway bar and drive the car aggresively, the stock endlinks will flex, thereby reducing the effectiveness of the larger bar you just installed. I have heard that the stock links can snap in half under extreme loading such as running on a track. It's all about trying to make that rear end come around!
Old May 8, 2003 | 11:11 AM
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Actually the bushing in the plastic end link will flex more than the link itself. Having a stiffer bushing helps. I was told that the plastic used is pretty stiff.
Old May 10, 2003 | 10:29 AM
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Originally posted by prodrive121
So are there any gains to be had from just swaping ou the endlinks?
And are there massive differnces between the kinds of links: Kart boy, White Line< Perrin< etc. why such a cost diff between whiteline and other?
The original 'coat hanger' type of endlinks from Whiteline are crap, which is why they're super cheap. The new solid Whitelines, part # KLC26 are very good. Peaty is right about the stock endlinks, it's the soft bushings that are the problem. (Well, not problem per se, but not as good as could be.)

What endlinks do is make the anti-roll bar more effective with faster response. It's sorta like increasing an engine's bottom-end power without adding to the peak. When the stock bushings deflect, it delays the action of the RSB from adding pressure to that wheel right away. It's maximum force is the same with either link. Basically, it will make your car a little bit faster responding to your inputs.

Short answer is, they're worth the money if you drive hard or autocross.
Old May 10, 2003 | 10:55 AM
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Here's another real life example.

I was running a front antisway bar on my wagon. Nice turn-in response, as compared to stock. A few weeks later, I installed the endlinks. Now, the turn-in response is SO much quicker. Especially during auto-cross.

You can distinctly feel when the endlinks stop flexing and force the sway bar to attempt to "twist" (the physics are kinda cool). The swaybar, being thicker than stock, does not "twist" as well and pulls the opposite wheel to the ground.

The result: as I turn the wheel, I can feel the swaybar "snap" into action and my front end sticks to the ground like glue.

Yes, I have a MASSIVE case of understeer, but I like it.
-Etch
Old May 12, 2003 | 03:44 AM
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From what I've heard from other wagon owners go with the 20mm sedan rear sway bar, and consider a rear strut bar to really stiffen up the whole car. The 20mm sedan bars should be a dime a dozen with all the sedan owners who upgrade.

I installed Perrin endlinks and noticed an immediate difference - as other people said, it just allows the sway bar to do more of it's intended job. I say if you're going to do the sway bar, do the endlinks at the same time.
Old May 12, 2003 | 11:16 PM
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i have just the rear endlinks and i was able to tell the difference from the get go. i bought the kartboys, they seem pretty damn sturdy.
with the new endlinks the response was much better, and the body roll was reduced greatly.

as for the front endlinks, i heard they are good as is. there is no use to replace the front ones.
Old May 12, 2003 | 11:37 PM
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Re: further swaybar/endlink????

Originally posted by prodrive121
1st thanks for all of the helpful imput I do have a couple of last questions:

how much oversteer will sway bar/ emdlinks cause?

If you put them on the back end, you should REDUCE the amount of understeer. I don't think you'd actually be neutral or prone to oversteer. Maybe on the highest setting

Do they Increase overall lateral grip or do they just change the nature of the cars steering? (i like neutral to mild understeer)

Yes, grip is increased from what I can tell. Still kinda new at this.

Is it lift throttle oversteer?

Yes. But also regular (throttled) oversteer, too.

If I do front endlinks, 21m rear sway and endlinks...how do you think the car will handle?

I have near this setup (add a 20mm front sway bar and up the rear to 22) and I have LOTS of understeer. However, at low-medium speeds the car is a go-cart, and at higher speeds, I can still get the end to come around. It just takes a bit of work.

-Etch
Old May 14, 2003 | 08:40 AM
  #11  
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I say if you're going to do the sway bar, do the endlinks at the same time.
i second that. i just talked to my Subaru dealer's service guy this morning, and he said they'd seen several cases of people breaking the stock rear end links while running aftermarket sway bars. it seems that the added stiffness of aftermarket bars places enough load on the stock links to eventually break them.
Old May 14, 2003 | 09:18 AM
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as for the front endlinks, i heard they are good as is. there is no use to replace the front ones.
I kept my front links but replaced the bushings with stiffer ones. KB at one time made inserts but I don't think they make them any more.



http://www.scoobymods.com/forums/sho...s=&threadid=35
Old May 14, 2003 | 01:28 PM
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how much differance did you notice with the aftermarket bushings in the stock front end links? i've only seen a few companies that make replacement front end links, even though everyone makes rear end links. just looking at the design of the fronts versus the rears, i wouldn't worry about breaking the front end links (unless something went catastrohpically wrong) like i would the rears. the ammount of force required to pull apart one of the front links would probably result in a bent sway bar well before the link broke. the rears on the other hand have two major stress risers (the bends in the link), and the design isn't as stout as i'd like. has anyone seen the front links off an STi? are they plastic too?
Old May 14, 2003 | 02:16 PM
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how much differance did you notice with the aftermarket bushings in the stock front end links?
With just the inserts in the top bushing the steering responce feels quicker, almost twitchy. The inserts were very hard, delrin I think.
Old Jul 10, 2003 | 04:28 PM
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Originally posted by Peaty
I kept my front links but replaced the bushings with stiffer ones. KB at one time made inserts but I don't think they make them any more.



http://www.scoobymods.com/forums/sho...s=&threadid=35

Just a little tid bit for those that are interested in the kartboy endlink bushings: I Pm'ed Peaty awhile ago and he told me to contact the Boys at Kartboy via email (i believe it's Mark and Tom). They still had sets of rear end link bushing laying around and I scooped up some for $30 via paypal. If you have a wagon go ahead and ask about bushings for the front links to if you feel up to it.

As for the install all i used was a 10-12mm short to deep socket and a monkey wrench to pop the old bushing out. Threw on some white lithium grease and threw the KB bushings on. DONE in 20minutes. Think about it if you're a little tight on budget and want similar effects of a stiff endlink.


eric

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