camber front and rear
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From: St. Louis MO
Car Info: 02 PSM WRX
camber front and rear
I just installed SPT springs (1.4 in front, 1.2 in rear) and I was wondering if I should try to get the same amount of negative camber in the front as the rear. Whitelines wheel alignment specs show (sport -1.50 in front and 1.00-1.25). Why more in front than the rear? After alignment I ended up with around -1.12 in front and -2 in rear with no toe and the car handels great but I dont know if it could be better with a different combination. I also was wondering how much tire wear I should expect if I changed toe in rear to 1-2mm out ( I have so3s). If you guys have played around with different setups I would appreciate any input you may have. Im trying to save some money so I would like to keep the number of alignments to a minimum.
thanks
thanks
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running more camber in the rear than the front will tend to make a WRX understeer more. i run more front camber than rear in an effort to keep the front planted, and to get the rear to rotate.
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I have what many would consider an odd alignment, but it seems to work.
-------- Camber --- Toe
front ------ -1.6 --- 0
rear ------ -2.5 --- 1/16 out
I also have a Whiteline ALK, stock front sway + links, and FHI 20mm RSB with Whiteline solid endlinks. I can say that my car is pretty much the epitome of 'neutral' in high-speed corners. I won't change a thing for either street or track use, but I will be adding a Whiteline adjustable sway bar for autocross to get more rotation at low speeds. Oh, and I run on 215/45R17 S03s.
-------- Camber --- Toe
front ------ -1.6 --- 0
rear ------ -2.5 --- 1/16 out
I also have a Whiteline ALK, stock front sway + links, and FHI 20mm RSB with Whiteline solid endlinks. I can say that my car is pretty much the epitome of 'neutral' in high-speed corners. I won't change a thing for either street or track use, but I will be adding a Whiteline adjustable sway bar for autocross to get more rotation at low speeds. Oh, and I run on 215/45R17 S03s.
Last edited by Kevin M; Jan 24, 2004 at 02:31 AM.
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From: St. Louis MO
Car Info: 02 PSM WRX
I just looked on Oakos website and it said factory camber in rear is -1.5 (sounds high)and front is around -0.5. Do you guys know that these #s are correct and if so why is the factory camber set up this way? When I talked to my mechanic he thought negative camber in front wouldnt help understeer that much because the car is AWD. He also said that he hadn't done any custom allignments on AWD cars but when he did it on RWD cars they seemed to like more negative camber in the rear. He used to run the pit crew on an open wheel race car and has had experience with a couple Miatas. So what I am wondering is if you guys that have went to more - camber in front have personally noticed a difference in understeer.
Thanks
Thanks
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From: your friendly neighborhood hairpin
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i'm currently running:
-1.0, 0 toe front
-.5, 0 toe rear
i have the whiteline ALK installed, and my cusco bar set to the middle of the three settings in the rear, with Perrin links. i'm also running STi V8 RA Spec-C struts, springs and tophats, plus a cusco front strut tower bar. oh yeah, i'm also riding on 17x8.5 gramlights with 225/45 S0-3s.
when i went to the new alignment, i noticed a significant decrease in understeer and the car became much more neutral. the alignment shop wasn't able to get more rear camber from my setup.
i have adjustable rear lateral links in my garage, so i'm going to get another alignment when i get them installed. right now, i'm thinking -2.0, zero toe up front, and -1.5 or so, with 1-2mm of toe out in the rear.
-1.0, 0 toe front
-.5, 0 toe rear
i have the whiteline ALK installed, and my cusco bar set to the middle of the three settings in the rear, with Perrin links. i'm also running STi V8 RA Spec-C struts, springs and tophats, plus a cusco front strut tower bar. oh yeah, i'm also riding on 17x8.5 gramlights with 225/45 S0-3s.
when i went to the new alignment, i noticed a significant decrease in understeer and the car became much more neutral. the alignment shop wasn't able to get more rear camber from my setup.
i have adjustable rear lateral links in my garage, so i'm going to get another alignment when i get them installed. right now, i'm thinking -2.0, zero toe up front, and -1.5 or so, with 1-2mm of toe out in the rear.
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i would agree with dropkick_muppet on the running more negative camber in the front, as that will help with the understeering tendencies of the wrx. i am currently running: -1.5 in the front and -1 in the rear, and my car handles quite well on the track. but i also have the cusco rsb set to the middle setting, coilovers, and whiteline alk.
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The primary reason the front camber is higher on the WRX platform than most other vehicles is due to its weight distribution. The higher weight % is at the front hence during the turns more weight is transformed to outside front wheel, which in turn causes more suspension deflection that results in more positive camber gains. The purpose is to offset this effect with higher negative camber.
I might be mistaken about this, but I do not think you can adjust the rear camber on the WRX, you cannot on the STi. Hence you might be stuck with the factory defaults on the rear. If it is like the STi, you will also be limited to about 1.7-1.8 negative camber at the front. Which is alright for street driving and may be you might want to lower it to about 1.2-1.3 to reduce uneven tire wear.
However, since you have lowered your vehicle, the negative camber will be increased both front and rear. If you cannot adjust the camber settings on the vehicle you may get stuck with too high of neg. camber which will truly cause rapid tire wear, if that is an issue at all. To combat this, you might want to get rear camber bolts to be able to adjust the rear camber to proper values.
If you do autocrosses or track days, you might also want to invest in front camber plates (Cobb has them for $250) which will allow you to adjust front camber per your driving situation.
Good luck.
FT
Sel Ground Performance
[ur]www.selgp.com[/url]
I might be mistaken about this, but I do not think you can adjust the rear camber on the WRX, you cannot on the STi. Hence you might be stuck with the factory defaults on the rear. If it is like the STi, you will also be limited to about 1.7-1.8 negative camber at the front. Which is alright for street driving and may be you might want to lower it to about 1.2-1.3 to reduce uneven tire wear.
However, since you have lowered your vehicle, the negative camber will be increased both front and rear. If you cannot adjust the camber settings on the vehicle you may get stuck with too high of neg. camber which will truly cause rapid tire wear, if that is an issue at all. To combat this, you might want to get rear camber bolts to be able to adjust the rear camber to proper values.
If you do autocrosses or track days, you might also want to invest in front camber plates (Cobb has them for $250) which will allow you to adjust front camber per your driving situation.
Good luck.
FT
Sel Ground Performance
[ur]www.selgp.com[/url]
Last edited by FT; Jan 28, 2004 at 11:40 AM.
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i believe the rear camber on the WRX is adjustable, however the range of adjustment is rather limited -- based on my last trip to the alignment shop i prefer. i have a set of Hotchkis adjustable rear lateral links that i'm planning on installing in the car this weekend to rectify the situation.
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on stock suspension, i dont' think the rear is adjustable... at least that's wut i was told the first time i took my car in for an alignment with springs..
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Originally posted by babysmurf
on stock suspension, i dont' think the rear is adjustable... at least that's wut i was told the first time i took my car in for an alignment with springs..
on stock suspension, i dont' think the rear is adjustable... at least that's wut i was told the first time i took my car in for an alignment with springs..
Last edited by MO REX; Jan 28, 2004 at 06:32 PM.
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hmmm. that makes me wonder how the alignment shop that i went to adjusted the rear... oh well, they did a hell of a job, so i don't really have any complaints. tie to get the lateral links installed...
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I have -2 front and -1.6 rear. 20mm rear bar, solid links front. DMS 50's I don't go into corners hot. I go in a bit slow and power hard thru the corner and out and it works for me.
Spring, dampening, bar size, tire pressure and driving style does make a differance on how much camber you will need to get the best patch on the road. So any one setting may work for one person but not the next.
Spring, dampening, bar size, tire pressure and driving style does make a differance on how much camber you will need to get the best patch on the road. So any one setting may work for one person but not the next.
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Originally posted by david2z4
I have -2 front and -1.6 rear. 20mm rear bar, solid links front. DMS 50's I don't go into corners hot. I go in a bit slow and power hard thru the corner and out and it works for me.
Spring, dampening, bar size, tire pressure and driving style does make a differance on how much camber you will need to get the best patch on the road. So any one setting may work for one person but not the next.
I have -2 front and -1.6 rear. 20mm rear bar, solid links front. DMS 50's I don't go into corners hot. I go in a bit slow and power hard thru the corner and out and it works for me.
Spring, dampening, bar size, tire pressure and driving style does make a differance on how much camber you will need to get the best patch on the road. So any one setting may work for one person but not the next.
Thanks.
Last edited by MO REX; Jan 29, 2004 at 08:58 PM.