...top end work?
08-14-2005, 06:42 PM
#1
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...top end work?
first off... i own an '02 OBS and i'm really liking it. i put street coilovers, strut braces, WRX sway bars, and toyo tires on it and it handles great. now in the quest for more driving pleasure i want to up my power a bit. i'm not looking into huge gains but i know i would like to get up around 200 bhp. i'm pretty sure i will have to replace the cams and possibly get cobb heads. how difficult is this on subarus? i've done top end work on old V8s and quite a few DOHC dirt bikes but i have never delt with an import car. i never had any problems with the work i've done in the past. i am just very tenative about working on unfamiliar engines. any advise is welcome. thanx.
08-15-2005, 03:11 AM
#2
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Car Info: 1995 Subaru Impreza 1.8 L
Dont expect much with an EJ22. 200hp would be expensive. The EJ25's are a bit easier to get to 200hp, but cams would still be neccessary.
What you would need:
Intake (cobb would be best, $250)
Full exhaust including headers and cat, but the EJ22 you have has only single port heads = bad (Borla headers for single port EJ22, $300, High flow cat section ~$250, catback ~250-500 depending on what you do)
Lightweight Flywheel/clutch ($600)
Lightweight pulley (Works fine on our perfectly ballanced boxer engines, I have one myself with a lightweight flywheel as well, $100)
Lots of headwork... I dont know how much EJ22 cams are, but probably the same $699 as most other EJ25 cams (Cobb heads, $$$ more but you probably want a 2.5 block, so more money there...)
At any rate, if you want a signifantly decent amount of more power, you want a WRX (IE an already turbo'ed motor that does over 200hp already) swap.
What you would need:
Intake (cobb would be best, $250)
Full exhaust including headers and cat, but the EJ22 you have has only single port heads = bad (Borla headers for single port EJ22, $300, High flow cat section ~$250, catback ~250-500 depending on what you do)
Lightweight Flywheel/clutch ($600)
Lightweight pulley (Works fine on our perfectly ballanced boxer engines, I have one myself with a lightweight flywheel as well, $100)
Lots of headwork... I dont know how much EJ22 cams are, but probably the same $699 as most other EJ25 cams (Cobb heads, $$$ more but you probably want a 2.5 block, so more money there...)
At any rate, if you want a signifantly decent amount of more power, you want a WRX (IE an already turbo'ed motor that does over 200hp already) swap.
08-15-2005, 06:35 AM
#3
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...but i though...
hey thanks for the tips, it's much appreciated. ....i thought subaru ditched the EJ22 back in '97? i know that every n/a USDM impreza since 02' has had the EJ25 (as does mine).
any other takers on this one? my main concern at this point is not what parts to buy. i'm interested in shop manuals and garage tips. i've never worked on a horizontally opposed engine and am wondering what the challenges are as compared to something like a chevy LS1 small block V8. my main concern is wether or not i have to pull the engine to swap cams or heads.
thanks~ matthew
any other takers on this one? my main concern at this point is not what parts to buy. i'm interested in shop manuals and garage tips. i've never worked on a horizontally opposed engine and am wondering what the challenges are as compared to something like a chevy LS1 small block V8. my main concern is wether or not i have to pull the engine to swap cams or heads.
thanks~ matthew
08-15-2005, 05:52 PM
#4
NASIOC Slut
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Oh sorry, you do have the EJ25. I saw OBS and forgot about the newer OBS's.
You might have to pull the motor to swap heads, I would. I dont think you can clear the bolts with it still in the car. Its a very light motor anyway (under 200lbs) Cams might be possible in the car, but it would be difficult.
You might have to pull the motor to swap heads, I would. I dont think you can clear the bolts with it still in the car. Its a very light motor anyway (under 200lbs) Cams might be possible in the car, but it would be difficult.
08-16-2005, 04:44 AM
#5
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Car Info: 2000 impreza 2.5 rs
definetly pull the engine!!!
I just about 'screwed the pooch' by gouging my sealing surfaces getting the heads out of my impreza..
Just think of it this way ... if you pull the engine you can always clean it up and repaint it
You have to take the intake, all of the drive accesories and front end, and exhaust mannafold off in order to get the heads of any way so why not just pull the engine, just a fiew more bolts at that point.
I just about 'screwed the pooch' by gouging my sealing surfaces getting the heads out of my impreza..
Just think of it this way ... if you pull the engine you can always clean it up and repaint it
You have to take the intake, all of the drive accesories and front end, and exhaust mannafold off in order to get the heads of any way so why not just pull the engine, just a fiew more bolts at that point.
08-17-2005, 04:13 AM
#7
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Car Info: 2000 impreza 2.5 rs
Originally Posted by mechanizedmedic
hey thanks a ton guys... now all i need is a good shop manual. hmmmmm?...
08-18-2005, 04:32 PM
#8
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Car Info: 2.5RS STI swapped
Yeah pull that ish out yo! No way no how would you want to swap heads with the block in the car. And you you should really easily be able to get 200HP especially if you wrench it yourself and save the money for installs on more parts. I wish I had a garage.
cheers
garrett
cheers
garrett
08-19-2005, 04:23 AM
#9
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I FOUND IT!!!
http://www.fastwrx.com/subimsermans.html
these guys sell the official subaru service manual set for the 02-03 impreza. (minus two uneeded volumes)
http://www.fastwrx.com/subimsermans.html
these guys sell the official subaru service manual set for the 02-03 impreza. (minus two uneeded volumes)
08-19-2005, 08:26 AM
#10
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Originally Posted by mechanizedmedic
02-03 impreza. (minus two uneeded volumes)
08-19-2005, 05:39 PM
#11
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nope... i forget why they omitted them from the set but the explanation is on their site. if you google "impreza service manual" there are tons of places selling service manuals for the 99-01's... the best site i found for that was overnight autoparts but when i tried to go back i couldn't find the manuals again. http://www.overnightautoparts.com/
there is also an online service manaul here.... http://www.mycarwizard.com/repair_manuals/Subaru.html
it requires you to pay autozone a subscription fee. i doubt it will be as detailed as some others but the "OEM part numbers" function could come in handy.
there is also an online service manaul here.... http://www.mycarwizard.com/repair_manuals/Subaru.html
it requires you to pay autozone a subscription fee. i doubt it will be as detailed as some others but the "OEM part numbers" function could come in handy.
08-21-2005, 08:14 PM
#12
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Join Date: Feb 2004
Posts: 44
From the various dyno charts posted here and there, 200hp at the crank doesn't need headwork. Cams, equal-length headers, an intake and some piggyback engine management will get you to 200.
To get much above 200 it looks like it will take some serious block prep to spin faster, standalone EM to raise the redline, some fancy headwork and you'll end up with a car that is loud, thirsty and quite possibly not reliable enough for a daily driver. Read Matt Monson and dcoty for the nitty gritty.
To get much above 200 it looks like it will take some serious block prep to spin faster, standalone EM to raise the redline, some fancy headwork and you'll end up with a car that is loud, thirsty and quite possibly not reliable enough for a daily driver. Read Matt Monson and dcoty for the nitty gritty.
08-22-2005, 11:56 AM
#13
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Posts: 163
should look at rallitek.com
they sell cams, and valve train stuff for the NA motors. i believe you can even get a set of 13:1 comp pistons.
back to the topic. the boxer engine is easy enough to work on. however i do recomemnd taking the engine out of the car to work on. i pulled 1 head of an ej22 while it was in teh the car. it was very difficult, only becuase the 8 bolts that hold the head on are SO LONG that when they are pulled all the way out to the wall of the engien bay they are stil in the heads. and you must then lift the entire unit out. far easier to do out of the car.
not to mention there is supposedly (i heard thie but have not checked it) a really messed up set of reinstall torque specs that you need to follow to seat the head correctly.
while the heads are out you might want to port and polish them. this should help you out, especially if you going to be doing high lift / long duration cams. gotta get those gasses moving.
other option. turbo kit. 3-4K and 200hp basically bolt on.
they sell cams, and valve train stuff for the NA motors. i believe you can even get a set of 13:1 comp pistons.
back to the topic. the boxer engine is easy enough to work on. however i do recomemnd taking the engine out of the car to work on. i pulled 1 head of an ej22 while it was in teh the car. it was very difficult, only becuase the 8 bolts that hold the head on are SO LONG that when they are pulled all the way out to the wall of the engien bay they are stil in the heads. and you must then lift the entire unit out. far easier to do out of the car.
not to mention there is supposedly (i heard thie but have not checked it) a really messed up set of reinstall torque specs that you need to follow to seat the head correctly.
while the heads are out you might want to port and polish them. this should help you out, especially if you going to be doing high lift / long duration cams. gotta get those gasses moving.
other option. turbo kit. 3-4K and 200hp basically bolt on.
08-22-2005, 04:27 PM
#14
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Location: SoCal
Posts: 170
Car Info: 2.5RS STI swapped
Keep in mind at 13:1 this will not be a daily driver. 11:1 you can do fine and even 11.2:1 will do ok on 91 octane.
You def. want to pull the engine for this job.
You always have the turbo option. For 4400 dollars, minus install, you can prolly get close to 300 crank HP. But it'll be less reliable and you'll always have to be tinkering with it as the weather or altitude changes. Many many posts on this.
cheers
garrett
You def. want to pull the engine for this job.
You always have the turbo option. For 4400 dollars, minus install, you can prolly get close to 300 crank HP. But it'll be less reliable and you'll always have to be tinkering with it as the weather or altitude changes. Many many posts on this.
cheers
garrett
Originally Posted by Dynapar
should look at rallitek.com
they sell cams, and valve train stuff for the NA motors. i believe you can even get a set of 13:1 comp pistons.
back to the topic. the boxer engine is easy enough to work on. however i do recomemnd taking the engine out of the car to work on. i pulled 1 head of an ej22 while it was in teh the car. it was very difficult, only becuase the 8 bolts that hold the head on are SO LONG that when they are pulled all the way out to the wall of the engien bay they are stil in the heads. and you must then lift the entire unit out. far easier to do out of the car.
not to mention there is supposedly (i heard thie but have not checked it) a really messed up set of reinstall torque specs that you need to follow to seat the head correctly.
while the heads are out you might want to port and polish them. this should help you out, especially if you going to be doing high lift / long duration cams. gotta get those gasses moving.
other option. turbo kit. 3-4K and 200hp basically bolt on.
they sell cams, and valve train stuff for the NA motors. i believe you can even get a set of 13:1 comp pistons.
back to the topic. the boxer engine is easy enough to work on. however i do recomemnd taking the engine out of the car to work on. i pulled 1 head of an ej22 while it was in teh the car. it was very difficult, only becuase the 8 bolts that hold the head on are SO LONG that when they are pulled all the way out to the wall of the engien bay they are stil in the heads. and you must then lift the entire unit out. far easier to do out of the car.
not to mention there is supposedly (i heard thie but have not checked it) a really messed up set of reinstall torque specs that you need to follow to seat the head correctly.
while the heads are out you might want to port and polish them. this should help you out, especially if you going to be doing high lift / long duration cams. gotta get those gasses moving.
other option. turbo kit. 3-4K and 200hp basically bolt on.
08-22-2005, 07:18 PM
#15
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Car Info: 2000 impreza 2.5 rs
port matching only takes about half a day and I noticed some improvement and is a great way to cut down on those long spool ups when you install an aftermarket turbo. You will need a die grinder and a couple of agressive bits..
has any one found a good piggy back that wont get learned around yet? every one i have read reviews on said "worked great for the first week then back to normal". would you guys recomend the rallitek one then take it down to a dino shop and get it tuned?... I didnt want to jack the tread but there are many threads like this with no resolution other than intake mods and safc's dont work.
has any one found a good piggy back that wont get learned around yet? every one i have read reviews on said "worked great for the first week then back to normal". would you guys recomend the rallitek one then take it down to a dino shop and get it tuned?... I didnt want to jack the tread but there are many threads like this with no resolution other than intake mods and safc's dont work.