DSav408

iTrader: (7)

You'd be surprised at how many people drink before driving everyday.

slugrx

iTrader: (12)

Not anywhere as brutal as drunk driving accidents...probably going to be more low speed late reaction-brake accidents

You'd be surprised on how many people drive high already, as with drunks

Gotta drive defensively

mickaeld

True! Crap We gotta be careful driving through those states. Actually going through Dolores Park windows down is enough to get you high lol!

PikkaGTR

iTrader: (4)

I dont have an issue with it being legalized.
I dont use and its a personal choice if one decides to use it or not.
I just feel that if it will become legal everywhere, that people who use have the common courtesy to smoke away from public places.
It's not nice to light up this or a cig in front of someone who doesn't smoke before asking them first if its ok

PikkaGTR

iTrader: (4)

you are assume these accidents dont happen on the free way
even at 60 in the slow lane a late reaction in braking to a car merging and slowing down to 15 mph is still brutal
Driving under the influence is still doesn't discriminate what type of influence you decide to be under, whether distracted with a cell phone or others things

w0ng3r

iTrader: (1)

is it a public area? if so, it may be rude, but he can still do w/e the hell he wants. as an ex cigarette smoker (8 years), people who get offended by smokers lighting up in public amuse me.

Choku Dori

iTrader: (2)

Dude, if I even just farted upwind of you in public, would you be offended?

STi-owns-evo

iTrader: (4)

My beliefs are mainly, less government involvement with people's lives, so I couldn't care less about if the government legalized it or not as long as your personal choices don't effect me.

Saying that, I can't believe how poor a lot of arguments are in this thread about why we should legalize it. 90% of what I see is "such and such is so much worse than marijuana and it's legal so there are 2 options. 1) legalize marijuana 2) the worse things should be illegal too"

This argument is just as stupid as me getting pulled over for speeding 35 in a 25 and telling the officer, "My friend didn't get a ticket when he drove 100 mph in this neighborhood, so I shouldn't get a ticket either! He was doing something so much more dangerous." I'm not talking about the legality of the speeding, I'm talking about using 2 different cases to justify one of them. Just because some things are legal and some things aren't doesn't mean jack squat. They're different cases.

And, please forgive my ignorance because I don't know a whole lot about marijuana, but aren't the paper, lotions, and basic stuff in these arguments moot point because the hemp (which I believe is the leaf part of the plant?) is legal? I see a whole lot of hemp lotions and lip balms and all that stuff on shelves. So if the leaves are legal to sell, how can the argument of big paper be valid?


I've never smoked marijuana, nor do I ever plan to. I know people are going to say, if you haven't smoked it, you can't judge it. While this is mostly true, I refer back to my first statement "as long as your personal choices don't effect me." So I have a question to people who have been high, as well as been the person who was sober around high people. If it is legalized, can this statement be upheld?

I've had only 2 experiences where I'm pretty sure they were high, so my experience is lacking. I'm a guy who loves real life examples, so I'm asking for any more input.

1) I have seen two guys high as hell spend about 5 minutes trying to figure out if they had enough money to buy some food at Jack in the Box. It literally looked like they were moving in slow motion. For the people who have experienced being high, is this an outlier or a common effect? I sure as hell would not want someone that slow anywhere near me on the road. Drivers are already oblivious enough as they are. Or, I would not want to stand in line waiting for change at the register for that long. People are already slow enough at basic math.

2) Random days where my girlfriend's ex would call at 1 am or later and she'd just get pissed and say he's high again. While this didn't bug me too much, it's more of do they even know what they're doing? I feel this is just like drunk dialing, so the brain is still somewhat impaired?

3) This one isn't an experience, but just a question. If marijuana is legalized, would the amount of people smoking in public increase? Cigarettes are already disgusting and plentiful enough, I hate the smell of anything being smoked whether it's cigars, cigarettes, hookah, or whatever else is out there.

TL;DR:
90% of arguments in this thread hold as much water as a screen door.
Hemp vs Marijuana
Can legalization not effect the daily lives of people who don't smoke?

DSav408

iTrader: (7)

Marijuana doesn't make people stupid. Those people were stupid before they smoked.

eastbaysubaru

iTrader: (9)

QFT

-Brian

wombatsauce

iTrader: (7)

This is awesome, and IMHO shows that you are actually interested in answers rather than just another ignorant detractor throwing illogical stones.

IMHO, the argument is not "it's not as bad as alcohol/tobacco so it should be legalized" but rather that it is not comparable to those things when looked at from the perspective of things that are harmful to us. We all can look even to our own lives for people who have hurt themselves and or others with alcohol, but you would be hard-pressed to find an actual real-life factual story of someone's life being harmed by the use of cannabis or someone else's in close proximity.

That being said, there will always be the person who says they never tried it, or did "so they know" and know of this one cousin's brother's auntie's former roomate who's "life was ruined by cannabis." There are first-hand experiences of people who said they were around friends who smoked. What I got out of that is there are some very sensitive, ignorant people out there - and copious amounts of bad data about cannabis.

This is depressing. Brucelee is right - do some research! Ed speaks some seriously sensible things about the subject as well. It is also interesting to consider the perspectives there - you have one person who was against it before until he took the time to do some research, and another who has personally experienced it in the course of life. Both make solid points that are logical, compared to some of the other crap in here.

I strongly believe that every single "bad experience" listed in this thread is the result of a personality rather than something that "cannabis made them do."

1. The people in line counting change were probably already stupid.

2. Your G/F's ex probably would do that anyway - worst case scenario getting drunk or stoned would make it more possible. Also, there are two sides to every story - what I mean here is you, nor she, knew whether or not he was stoned/drunk/huffing canned air or whatever. I have heard people describe others as being "stoned" who were clearly not - BUT - this person did not have a better/correct way to say it and perhaps someone would over-hear them and think that is what a "stoned" person does. Also, "stoned" used to describe drunk. Fun with history!

3. I would certainly hope not, but you have to consider people and how they behave. Have you been able to detect a difference in smokers? There are at least two very distinctive types - people who will instantly make a cig dissappear in the presence of a child, people that are obviously courteous and attentive to the fact they they are creating a harmful, stinky cloud around them. Then there are the people with varying degrees of "eff you" to all of this, people that blow smoke at others, leave butts around, and generally suck. The funny thing is I have known people like this, and it has far more to do with personality than a specific substance. If only we could make it illegal to be an ***-hole!

This - your number 3, is a very important question indeed, but - you also need to consider that there will be things, smells, out there in the world that you do not appreciate. My wife hates the smell of roasting coffee, but I quite like it. I grew up around cannabis - it, it's use, and users of such have been a part of my life since I can remember. The smell does not bother me, and when I am walking in a town somewhere and I smell it, I usually am interested to see who it is that is smoking mostly for my personal demographic entertainment. At the same time, I can completely see how the smell would bother you - as the smell of cigarettes and especially old smoke, or the smell in an elevator once a smoker enters bothers me. I don't think I would ever openly complain about this or say it were a reason to ban smoking, because we are all different - but that's just me. I mean, my neighbor drives a green new beetle and I hate that thing, but she loves it. I feel no reason to ban them even though I don't like it (plus it is not causing me any harm, aside from it's emissions of course).

Also I feel compelled to mention that with my experience around cannabis from childhood to what some would call adulthood, I have never experienced anyone who has had adverse affects in their life as a result of cannabis usage. I am sure that some of these people would have been more inspired and gotten more done, but who are we to judge? I had an aunt who died of lung cancer, my grandfather had heart issues that were linked to alcohol, and my mother was killed by a drunk driver when I was a child.

The way I was brought up, it was made abundantly clear that alcohol, cannabis, cigarettes, and things of that nature (even coffee for that matter) were adult things that I was not allowed to touch. When I was 18, my pops took me down to the beach and we smoked a J together and he told me that now it was up to me to make my own decisions, but he reminded me of the data that I had taken in over the years about how people act under the influence of ANYTHING as well as the personal experience of family members dying as a result of their and others' use of legal substances. He also told me to NEVER talk about it, because there are people that still buy into the "Reefer Madness" propaganda, and will categorize/label you based on their ignorance, fear, and abject need to place a label on things.

Like my friend's wife with her brother who's "life was ruined by cannabis" well - he was a bad person who did bad things and probably was even before he found cannabis, but - she needed a reason for it. The worst part about that are the people that also had no idea about cannabis, and took her seriously. "Wow, cannabis made your brother that way? WOW it must be terrible!" And this, is the problem.

There are people that are courteous, sensible and responsible, and there are people that are inconsiderate and lame. Sometimes, these behaviors can be amplified with alcohol, caffeine, and even cannabis. These people will always exist, and will make things worse for others whether they are drinking a 40, riding a horse, or smoking a joint.

Growing up on the Big Island of Hawaii, I have heard many stories about meth-heads and things of that nature. I do not believe I have known anyone who is/was a "meth-head" and I know nothing about it, beyond the stories I have heard. To me, it sounds like a vile evil potion that turns people into monsters. But this is just ignorance on my part.

As far as harm being caused to you with second hand smoke, well, that would have to be a lot of smoke. If you are like me, and I know I am, you have left your house before. Sometimes there are diesel trucks spewing smoke, cars that smell nasty (catless), and I mean - shoot, my dog's farts must be toxic. I would imagine that being behind all the traffic on 101 every day in my commute is a lot worse for me than the second-hand smoke I have inhaled, even if I didn't like it.

IMHO, to briefly answer your question about whether or not legalization would affect the lives of others who don't smoke. Well, in a perfect world - no. In this world - yes.

Remember, this post is worth what you paid for it. Also, I did not touch the items of medical usage, which I personally believe to be valid even though the system has let a lot of "recreational" folks through. I personally do not know the answer there, and agree that the current system does not meet the needs insofar as ensuring that the cannabis does not show up in the wrong hands. Again, I believe this boils down to people, accountability and personal responsibility.

I believe that Ed pointed out the largest barrier to legalization, and that is the ability to deduce levels of intoxication, preferably with a machine that spits out an answer so the human does not need to be required to think.

On top of that, I personally believe that legalization would help keep it out of the hands of children and such. This may be more ignorance on my part, but I have personal experience seeing friends in school get involved and have heard talks that correspond to this. For a kid, $50 is a good chunk of change. So, take a "dealer" with questionable morals. They recruit kids because they are bored, willing, and such, and has the kid distribute his product, and gives a $50 bonus, which blows the kids mind and has them coming back for more. Well, legalization would mean that dealer with questionable morals would have to get a real job, as he would not be able to compete price-wise anymore and at any rate, when people can buy it legally they are not going to bother with kids. Yes, to be clear, kids in school that were my age were selling cannabis to adults. I believe this happens all the time, and is "a thing" if you will. I believe this would essentially go away with legalization. From what I have heard, this situation makes it a lot easier for a kid to get a sack of cannabis than it is to get some alcohol or a pack of cigarettes. It would be nice if all of those were hard.

TL;DR: We all need to share this planet. It is what it is.

Lurk

iTrader: (10)

So how much are you allowed to possess in Colorado now? For example, does it matter if it's an ounce of bud or concentrate?

slugrx

iTrader: (12)

Decriminalized up to one oz of buds...not sure about concentrates

And VERY well said wombatsauce

RAWeiss

iTrader: (12)

joe rogan in "the union" (great pot documentary that should still be on netflix) said it best