Question: Will the plane fly? (warning: nerdy)
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Originally Posted by iBlueVirus
Pete,
I don't think it's a question if airspeed = 0 or not. I think we know the airspeed > 0. HOWEVER, in a real world, with jets/props alone, can they generate enough airspeed for the plane to take-off?
I do agree the plane CAN take-off IF the props/jets can generate enough airspeed for the plane to take off.
I don't think it's a question if airspeed = 0 or not. I think we know the airspeed > 0. HOWEVER, in a real world, with jets/props alone, can they generate enough airspeed for the plane to take-off?
I do agree the plane CAN take-off IF the props/jets can generate enough airspeed for the plane to take off.
What else would generate air speed on a plane besides its props or jets??
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Originally Posted by dr3d1zzl3
what cracks me up is how up tight people get over the stupidest of ****....
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Originally Posted by EQ Tuning
No one's getting up tight... just a bit frustrated.
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Originally Posted by psoper
I was usually laughing when I typed my replies, despite all my yelling, I just thought these guys were smarter than that....
Exactly...
Physical movement of the plane in relation to the ground... Any object that moves in a non-vacuum space would have air speed > 0.
Again, I don't design planes. But as far as I know jets and props only move air in their path (forget about turbulent for a moment). That is why in mythbusters the car won't move from its path until it gets into the path of the jet wash.
I agree that the plane would move in relation to air in this case. I just don't know if jets/props alone can generate enough air speed on the WHOLE plane for it to take-off.
Because if it does take-off with jets/props alone, I don't know why Boeing and Lockheed fought so long and hard to get a jet to take off from standing still.
Again, I don't design planes. But as far as I know jets and props only move air in their path (forget about turbulent for a moment). That is why in mythbusters the car won't move from its path until it gets into the path of the jet wash.
I agree that the plane would move in relation to air in this case. I just don't know if jets/props alone can generate enough air speed on the WHOLE plane for it to take-off.
Because if it does take-off with jets/props alone, I don't know why Boeing and Lockheed fought so long and hard to get a jet to take off from standing still.
Originally Posted by EQ Tuning
What else would generate air speed on a plane besides its props or jets??
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Originally Posted by iBlueVirus
Physical movement of the plane in relation to the ground... Any object that moves in a non-vacuum space would have air speed > 0.
Again, I don't design planes. But as far as I know jets and props only move air in their path (forget about turbulent for a moment). That is why in mythbusters the car won't move from its path until it gets into the path of the jet wash.
I agree that the plane would move in relation to air in this case. I just don't know if jets/props alone can generate enough air speed on the WHOLE plane for it to take-off.
Because if it does take-off with jets/props alone, I don't know why Boeing and Lockheed fought so long and hard to get a jet to take off from standing still.
Again, I don't design planes. But as far as I know jets and props only move air in their path (forget about turbulent for a moment). That is why in mythbusters the car won't move from its path until it gets into the path of the jet wash.
I agree that the plane would move in relation to air in this case. I just don't know if jets/props alone can generate enough air speed on the WHOLE plane for it to take-off.
Because if it does take-off with jets/props alone, I don't know why Boeing and Lockheed fought so long and hard to get a jet to take off from standing still.
You're still not getting it. The plane moves not only in relation to the air but also in relation to stationary ground just as it would if it was taking off from a regular runway.
LOL!!! That's just too WAY too funny!!
You are telling me that you get wind blow in your face when you run on a treadmill? I was just on one yesterday and I didn't feel a thing (other then I was sweating like a pig).
You are telling me that you get wind blow in your face when you run on a treadmill? I was just on one yesterday and I didn't feel a thing (other then I was sweating like a pig).
Originally Posted by EQ Tuning
You're still not getting it. The plane moves not only in relation to the air but also in relation to stationary ground just as it would if it was taking off from a regular runway.
Plus, I thought we have established wheel speed and plane speed in relation to ground is irrelevant.
A runway is needed for a plan to take-off, is not to get speed on plane vs ground. The reason for it is by doing so the plane would gain MORE air speed than just props/jets alone.
A runway is needed for a plan to take-off, is not to get speed on plane vs ground. The reason for it is by doing so the plane would gain MORE air speed than just props/jets alone.
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Originally Posted by iBlueVirus
Physical movement of the plane in relation to the ground... Any object that moves in a non-vacuum space would have air speed > 0.
Originally Posted by iBlueVirus
Again, I don't design planes. But as far as I know jets and props only move air in their path (forget about turbulent for a moment). That is why in mythbusters the car won't move from its path until it gets into the path of the jet wash.
I agree that the plane would move in relation to air in this case. I just don't know if jets/props alone can generate enough air speed on the WHOLE plane for it to take-off.
Because if it does take-off with jets/props alone, I don't know why Boeing and Lockheed fought so long and hard to get a jet to take off from standing still.
I agree that the plane would move in relation to air in this case. I just don't know if jets/props alone can generate enough air speed on the WHOLE plane for it to take-off.
Because if it does take-off with jets/props alone, I don't know why Boeing and Lockheed fought so long and hard to get a jet to take off from standing still.
But other than keeping the plane from falling to the ground, the wheels do not apply any force effecting the accelleration of the plane (unlike the case of a car or bicycle, which is where most people arguing this, and even you still Leo- seem to be losing their minds)
VTOL planes are burdened with a need for their engines to not only accellerate the airfame foward, but also to overcome gravity directly without the aid of aerodynamic lift, and the real challenge isn't so much in creating the force, rather the hard part comes in keeping the thing stable when under that kind of force, its kind of like balacing a broom on one finger, all the weight wants to fall off the thrust vector, and with that much thrust involved, getting a little bit out of balance has disasterous consequences.
Last edited by psoper; Jan 25, 2006 at 04:23 PM.