FW Motorsports
03-01-2012, 07:10 PM
#167
Full disclosure:
This is one of our customer's cars that we built back in 2009. This was a stage 1 engine and was originally built to run a stock VF39 turbo. This engine was built using the original crank and rods that had miles on them at the time.
Later the customer upgraded to run the VF39 on E85 and ran it that way for abou a year. Eventually, the customer wanted even more power and decided to upgrade the turbo to a Blouch Dom 3.0XTR and run it on E85 as well.
The customer was informed that the engine was never built to support this kind of power so there was no guarantee on how long it would hold up. The car was tuned semi-conservatively at about 23psi on E85, making about 420whp. It ran this way for about 6-7 months until one day the customer got on it and one of the original OEM rods let go.
Until this point, the car ran very well and had no major issues. This was simply too much power for the aged stock rods to handle and eventually one let go. This is certainly unfortunate for the customer, but ultimately, he was well informed and made the decision to run this power level. The known weak point of the engine was exactly what failed as expected.
This is why we don't recommend using the OEM rods for anything at or over 400whp. Our stage 2 engines with Manley I-Beam rods are meant for that kind of power range.
I hope this clears up any mysteries as we honestly have nothing to hide. I hope the customer is happy with his rebuild at FW and wish him and his car all the best in the future.
Thanks
-- Ed
This is one of our customer's cars that we built back in 2009. This was a stage 1 engine and was originally built to run a stock VF39 turbo. This engine was built using the original crank and rods that had miles on them at the time.
Later the customer upgraded to run the VF39 on E85 and ran it that way for abou a year. Eventually, the customer wanted even more power and decided to upgrade the turbo to a Blouch Dom 3.0XTR and run it on E85 as well.
The customer was informed that the engine was never built to support this kind of power so there was no guarantee on how long it would hold up. The car was tuned semi-conservatively at about 23psi on E85, making about 420whp. It ran this way for about 6-7 months until one day the customer got on it and one of the original OEM rods let go.
Until this point, the car ran very well and had no major issues. This was simply too much power for the aged stock rods to handle and eventually one let go. This is certainly unfortunate for the customer, but ultimately, he was well informed and made the decision to run this power level. The known weak point of the engine was exactly what failed as expected.
This is why we don't recommend using the OEM rods for anything at or over 400whp. Our stage 2 engines with Manley I-Beam rods are meant for that kind of power range.
I hope this clears up any mysteries as we honestly have nothing to hide. I hope the customer is happy with his rebuild at FW and wish him and his car all the best in the future.
Thanks
-- Ed
Last edited by EQ Tuning; 03-01-2012 at 09:44 PM.
03-02-2012, 09:28 AM
#171
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Join Date: Mar 2011
Location: The Bay Area
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Car Info: 2006 STI
If your told that you will risk getting electrocuted if you stick a fork/metal object in a wall plug outlet and you stick the fork in the wall plug outlet and get shocked, is that the wall plugs fault, PG&E, Or your own for not listening to what you were told?
03-02-2012, 09:40 AM
#172
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Watson,Kalifas!
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Car Info: Un Carrito Que Hace Vrooom Phsss!
I can see your point.. But why built/tune a future blown engine? I see both sides... Shoulda builder walk away from stuff like this even if the customer wants it that way? Or should a builder say " no I won't waste my time building an engine that won't run your power safely"?
03-02-2012, 10:06 AM
#173
I can see your point.. But why built/tune a future blown engine? I see both sides... Shoulda builder walk away from stuff like this even if the customer wants it that way? Or should a builder say " no I won't waste my time building an engine that won't run your power safely"?
Ultimately it is the customer's car and his decision to take the risk to go over the rated power levels. Sometimes stock rods can hold this kind of power, but sometimes they cannot. Being well informed, he took the risk and I tuned the car to try to get it to last while still meeting the customer's power goals. It lasted 6 months this way and eventually the weak link failed.
I don't believe anyone is at fault in this kind of situation. There was nothing mechanically wrong with the build. A weak part simply failed from excessive power levels. It was a risk the customer understood and accepted.
Thanks
-- Ed
Last edited by EQ Tuning; 03-02-2012 at 10:18 AM.
03-02-2012, 10:32 AM
#174
previously known as wrxBRAH
iTrader: (17)
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Location: San Jose / Campbell
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Car Info: 2004 FXT
I can see your point.. But why built/tune a future blown engine? I see both sides... Shoulda builder walk away from stuff like this even if the customer wants it that way? Or should a builder say " no I won't waste my time building an engine that won't run your power safely"?
03-02-2012, 11:43 AM
#175
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Join Date: Sep 2008
Location: Watson,Kalifas!
Posts: 4,064
Car Info: Un Carrito Que Hace Vrooom Phsss!
I know it all came down to him since you told hi
Wat could happen, that being said... I'm not blaming you. Every business is ran differently. My uncle owns a body shop in Arizona, he gives a life time warranty on anything that gets sprayed there.. He gets people who want cheap paint jobs... That won't last long and he can't give a warranty on. He just simply refuses to paint their cars. Cause when that paint starts to peel, it's his company's that did the job at the end of day. Is there a reason why he didn't return to you?
Wat could happen, that being said... I'm not blaming you. Every business is ran differently. My uncle owns a body shop in Arizona, he gives a life time warranty on anything that gets sprayed there.. He gets people who want cheap paint jobs... That won't last long and he can't give a warranty on. He just simply refuses to paint their cars. Cause when that paint starts to peel, it's his company's that did the job at the end of day. Is there a reason why he didn't return to you?
03-02-2012, 11:54 AM
#176
I know it all came down to him since you told hi
Wat could happen, that being said... I'm not blaming you. Every business is ran differently. My uncle owns a body shop in Arizona, he gives a life time warranty on anything that gets sprayed there.. He gets people who want cheap paint jobs... That won't last long and he can't give a warranty on. He just simply refuses to paint their cars. Cause when that paint starts to peel, it's his company's that did the job at the end of day. Is there a reason why he didn't return to you?
Wat could happen, that being said... I'm not blaming you. Every business is ran differently. My uncle owns a body shop in Arizona, he gives a life time warranty on anything that gets sprayed there.. He gets people who want cheap paint jobs... That won't last long and he can't give a warranty on. He just simply refuses to paint their cars. Cause when that paint starts to peel, it's his company's that did the job at the end of day. Is there a reason why he didn't return to you?
I'm not sure why the customer chose to go to another shop, but that's none of my business as long as he happy in the end. That's all that really matters.
Thanks
-- Ed
03-02-2012, 01:03 PM
#177
banned
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Jun 2011
Location: 2006 Zero/sports Widebody
Posts: 1,669
Car Info: 500+ whp Club
I can see your point.. But why built/tune a future blown engine? I see both sides... Shoulda builder walk away from stuff like this even if the customer wants it that way? Or should a builder say " no I won't waste my time building an engine that won't run your power safely"?
Next is you can't control a human. They are more dangerous to an engine then the engine itself. And engines are controlled explosions. Humans in the car world will always want more, or will always want to push for more power. Only some learn you cant have it all. And its going to cost $$ to play in this world. And even having the best parts and builders in the world is still no guaranty. Even on my build I still have my stuff to deal with. And I have all name brand quality parts.
Last edited by old.guy; 03-02-2012 at 01:08 PM.
03-02-2012, 02:39 PM
#179
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Join Date: Nov 2010
Location: $acto
Posts: 587
Car Info: 90 325is
I could only find a drawing with very basic dimentions. Anyone know where to find a more detailed one? Better yet, anyone in sac have a .50 round i can borrow. I guessed on most of the stuff.
