Holy FLIP FLOP Batman!
09-06-2006, 11:41 AM
#1
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Holy FLIP FLOP Batman!
BUSH REVERSES: AL QAEDA TO GET GENEVA CONVENTION RIGHTS
http://abcnews.go.com/International/story?id=2400470
Found this on drudge just a minute ago....Nothing like tailoring your policy around a midterm election! OMG WHAT A FLIP FLOPPER!
What a complete joke of a president......
http://abcnews.go.com/International/story?id=2400470
Found this on drudge just a minute ago....Nothing like tailoring your policy around a midterm election! OMG WHAT A FLIP FLOPPER!
What a complete joke of a president......
Last edited by SilverScoober02; 09-06-2006 at 11:44 AM.
09-06-2006, 11:54 AM
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Things like this and the thread about Clinton's anti-terrorism bills make one thing very clear to me. The republican party is better at marketing and getting themselves elected in this country...but that skill has no bearing on their ability to run the country. Shame on the GOP for making politics about something other than running the country for the best of the American people.
09-06-2006, 02:21 PM
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Yes, there's no problem with giving these prisoners the correct rights according to international law. The thing is, people have been saying that all along (mostly 'evil anti-American liberals...). It's too late for the GOP to claim ANY credit for giving these prisoners any type of rights. Credit should be given to those who knew what was morally right from the begining and didn't try to justify internationally illegal actions.
09-06-2006, 04:46 PM
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Well congrats on the liberal victory!
A great victory indeed...
Listen, I'm all for rights but just because the Geneva Conventions is in place doesn't mean it's a good thing. Why in the hell would anyone want credit for this? I certainly wouldn't want this blood on my hands down the road...
These are dangerous men, with unparalleled knowledge about terrorist networks and their plans of new attacks," Bush said. "The security of our nation and the lives of our citizens depend on our ability to learn what these terrorists know."
...
The administration has come under criticism not only for the secret detentions but for the alleged psychological and physical stress they put on prisoners during interrogations.
...
The administration has come under criticism not only for the secret detentions but for the alleged psychological and physical stress they put on prisoners during interrogations.
Listen, I'm all for rights but just because the Geneva Conventions is in place doesn't mean it's a good thing. Why in the hell would anyone want credit for this? I certainly wouldn't want this blood on my hands down the road...
Last edited by Salty; 09-06-2006 at 04:50 PM.
09-07-2006, 09:20 AM
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"I'd rather be right than consistent" - Winston Churchill
"Consistency is the last refuge of the unimaginitive." -Oscar Wilde
Politicians should never be scolded for changing their views; only for taking on poor ones.
"Consistency is the last refuge of the unimaginitive." -Oscar Wilde
Politicians should never be scolded for changing their views; only for taking on poor ones.
09-07-2006, 12:32 PM
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Well I think Bush's initial actions on this matter relate with both those quotes. Sure, doing what he did was wrong legally but I think it was the right thing to do and still think so. Again, I wouldn't want to steal the credit away from the liberals... they can have this one.
09-07-2006, 12:36 PM
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I think having a government that supports violations of the GC is poor policy. The next time we enter a war, what can we say against an enemy that violates it with american POWs?
09-07-2006, 12:48 PM
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The liberals shouldn't get credit for this. If this wasn't an election year and Iraq wasn't handled so badly then he wouldn't be flip-flopping on this issue. It's not like liberal pressure caused his flip-flop. Republicans are on the verge of losing precious seats in congress in this mid-term and they are doing everything they can just to keep them.
BAN I agree and disagree with you on this. I think that if we were fighting a war in the traditional sense where the people we were fighting against might adhere to the Geneva Convention then I would agree with you whole-heartedly but we aren't. We wouldn't be given quarter by any of these people if we were POW's, it's just that simple. It is a slippery slope I agree and I am torn on this issue very much.
BAN I agree and disagree with you on this. I think that if we were fighting a war in the traditional sense where the people we were fighting against might adhere to the Geneva Convention then I would agree with you whole-heartedly but we aren't. We wouldn't be given quarter by any of these people if we were POW's, it's just that simple. It is a slippery slope I agree and I am torn on this issue very much.
09-07-2006, 12:51 PM
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Originally Posted by BAN SUVS
The next time we enter a war, what can we say against an enemy that violates it with american POWs?
If you mean real torture and disembowelment then perhaps "common practice?" I dunno... ???
Look, I do see your point and I know it was poor policy but actions behind the policy weren't appalling. Your comparison is not a reasonable one seeing how American POWs will never be terrorists capable of elaborate plots that do not involve formal military structure. Hell, even if we were at war our troops wouldn't have the resources to be this type of threat. You know this because you served. There's not a hundred Army mechanic cells plotting to overthrow Tehran as we speak. Although it was legally wrong, I think detaining these types of "unusual combatants" as being the right thing as opposed to abiding by law which would is the consistent factor.
This is just the way I see it. I know this had to be done eventually, but...
09-07-2006, 12:52 PM
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Originally Posted by SilverScoober02
BAN I agree and disagree with you on this. I think that if we were fighting a war in the traditional sense where the people we were fighting against might adhere to the Geneva Convention then I would agree with you whole-heartedly but we aren't. We wouldn't be given quarter by any of these people if we were POW's, it's just that simple. It is a slippery slope I agree and I am torn on this issue very much.
09-07-2006, 12:55 PM
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Originally Posted by SilverScoober02
It's not like liberal pressure caused his flip-flop. Republicans are on the verge of losing precious seats in congress in this mid-term and they are doing everything they can just to keep them.
09-07-2006, 12:57 PM
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Originally Posted by Salty
If you mean real torture and disembowelment then perhaps "common practice?" I dunno... ???
Look, I do see your point and I know it was poor policy but actions behind the policy weren't appalling. Your comparison is not a reasonable one seeing how American POWs will never be terrorists capable of elaborate plots that do not involve formal military structure. Hell, even if we were at war our troops wouldn't have the resources to be this type of threat. You know this because you served. There's not a hundred Army mechanic cells plotting to overthrow Tehran as we speak. Although it was legally wrong, I think detaining these types of "unusual combatants" as being the right thing as opposed to abiding by law which would is the consistent factor.
This is just the way I see it. I know this had to be done eventually, but...
Look, I do see your point and I know it was poor policy but actions behind the policy weren't appalling. Your comparison is not a reasonable one seeing how American POWs will never be terrorists capable of elaborate plots that do not involve formal military structure. Hell, even if we were at war our troops wouldn't have the resources to be this type of threat. You know this because you served. There's not a hundred Army mechanic cells plotting to overthrow Tehran as we speak. Although it was legally wrong, I think detaining these types of "unusual combatants" as being the right thing as opposed to abiding by law which would is the consistent factor.
This is just the way I see it. I know this had to be done eventually, but...
09-07-2006, 12:58 PM
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Originally Posted by Salty
Maybe not pressure but certainly liberal view. Why else would they bother? So if the liberals do not get credit for this, then does that mean everyone blames Bush once these terrorists come together and follow through with another plot to attack the US? Do you see where I'm coming from here?
09-07-2006, 12:59 PM
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Originally Posted by BAN SUVS
The fact that our enemies sometimes break the rules of the Geneva convention does not grant us the right to do the same. We are supposed to be the good guys in white hats; we must act as such in all cases without fail. There can be no justification or rationalization for failing to adhere to our own laws.
This topic is like abortion to me in that I support the woman's right but hate the idea. But in this case flip it around in that I like the idea of holding people that will continue to be threats but hate the fact it goes against what you've mentioned above.