View Poll Results: Should we teach evolution in schools?
Yes
10
52.63%
No
1
5.26%
Yes, with disclamer "It's just a theory"
3
15.79%
Other (Please explain)
5
26.32%
Voters: 19. You may not vote on this poll
Evolution Wars hurting our children?
06-04-2005, 02:13 PM
#1
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Evolution Wars hurting our children?
I just wanted to see what everyone thought about what some religious people thought about teaching evolution in the classroom. Not to mention your stances.
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/8074471/
Originally Posted by MSN
McCoy, who has won the Georgia “Outstanding Biology Teacher” award, is active in his Presbyterian church and also serves on the National Executive Board of the Presbyterian Association on Science, Technology and the Christian faith, is saddened by what he has seen in his classroom.
“Students face consequences if they choose to accept evolution in a family or a church or a community that patently rejects evolution ... It might affect whether you get a date to the prom, or whether you get that summer job or not,” McCoy said. “You may even anger close family members. Conversations about evolution can make family reunions very tense.”
Clare McKinney teaches biology and zoology at Jefferson High School in Lafayette, Indiana. She is also a Christian who has been on national news defending the teaching of evolution in the classroom.
McKinney explained why the debate over evolution versus creationism is appealing — and important — to children in her classes.
“For kids this age, fairness is a real issue. Many children, who are not even familiar with the sound evidence surrounding evolution, signed petitions to 'include' intelligent design because it seemed 'fair,'” said McKinney. That said, she also understands the pressure these children feel to “reconcile” their beliefs with science — she went through it herself.
According to McKinney, interested students have waited until they are outside the classroom to discuss what they perceive as “conflicting” views. “I have flat out told students that the more I know about science, the more glorious God seems,” said McKinney.
She stresses in her classroom that “science is not out to prove the presence or absence of God - whatever you believe, it’s OK," adding, “You can almost see the anxiety level diminish when I say that.”
But what concerns educators like Miller is whether this politicization of basic science dissuades children from going into the field.
Miller, an enthusiastic Catholic who wrote the book "Finding Darwin’s God: A Scientist’s Search for Common Ground between God and Evolution,” finds this troubling.
“Students face consequences if they choose to accept evolution in a family or a church or a community that patently rejects evolution ... It might affect whether you get a date to the prom, or whether you get that summer job or not,” McCoy said. “You may even anger close family members. Conversations about evolution can make family reunions very tense.”
Clare McKinney teaches biology and zoology at Jefferson High School in Lafayette, Indiana. She is also a Christian who has been on national news defending the teaching of evolution in the classroom.
McKinney explained why the debate over evolution versus creationism is appealing — and important — to children in her classes.
“For kids this age, fairness is a real issue. Many children, who are not even familiar with the sound evidence surrounding evolution, signed petitions to 'include' intelligent design because it seemed 'fair,'” said McKinney. That said, she also understands the pressure these children feel to “reconcile” their beliefs with science — she went through it herself.
According to McKinney, interested students have waited until they are outside the classroom to discuss what they perceive as “conflicting” views. “I have flat out told students that the more I know about science, the more glorious God seems,” said McKinney.
She stresses in her classroom that “science is not out to prove the presence or absence of God - whatever you believe, it’s OK," adding, “You can almost see the anxiety level diminish when I say that.”
But what concerns educators like Miller is whether this politicization of basic science dissuades children from going into the field.
Miller, an enthusiastic Catholic who wrote the book "Finding Darwin’s God: A Scientist’s Search for Common Ground between God and Evolution,” finds this troubling.
06-05-2005, 10:58 PM
#2
If it is to be taught (wich I'm not nescesarilly against) it should be reserved to higher education, til students are able to make educated decisions on thier own 
, put it in the same catagory as religion or philosophy, because after all, it is philosophy and not yet a proven science. (proven-science = oxymoron, that's why we call it the PRACTICE of medicine) 
, put it in the same catagory as religion or philosophy, because after all, it is philosophy and not yet a proven science. (proven-science = oxymoron, that's why we call it the PRACTICE of medicine)
06-06-2005, 08:51 AM
#3
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They need to just make an elective subject on theology to make everyone happy. I mean it's not science, it's faith. They require biology and other sciences because unlike religion, science has a zillion times the amount of proof. Some books in science are closed for crying out loud.
Here's a great idea! How about being a good parent at home?! Instead of watching re-runs of NASCAR and Blue Collar Comedy Tour why don't you sit down with your child and crack the book you praise? You can teach your religion how you deem fit. You can be open about it and accept the fact your children may not accept your teachings and respect them and love them for that decision. OR you can feed spoonfuls of glorified crap down your kid’s throat about how praying and watching the 700 club is going to fix the world and your retarded brother who cannot walk or speak.
I have nothing against religion whatsoever but when people insist it be forced on others (someday my children) I get beet red in the face. It’s not that religion is wrong either. It’s just that science has so much proof we cannot overlook it in the slightest. Go find me the bones of every person in the bible and a part of the frame from Noah’s Ark. Then we’ll talk. I don’t want a piece of some old vessel either. I want you to use science to find Giraffe **** residue on the deck as well as the possible shape of the ship by looking at the one piece you find.
Here's a great idea! How about being a good parent at home?! Instead of watching re-runs of NASCAR and Blue Collar Comedy Tour why don't you sit down with your child and crack the book you praise? You can teach your religion how you deem fit. You can be open about it and accept the fact your children may not accept your teachings and respect them and love them for that decision. OR you can feed spoonfuls of glorified crap down your kid’s throat about how praying and watching the 700 club is going to fix the world and your retarded brother who cannot walk or speak.
I have nothing against religion whatsoever but when people insist it be forced on others (someday my children) I get beet red in the face. It’s not that religion is wrong either. It’s just that science has so much proof we cannot overlook it in the slightest. Go find me the bones of every person in the bible and a part of the frame from Noah’s Ark. Then we’ll talk. I don’t want a piece of some old vessel either. I want you to use science to find Giraffe **** residue on the deck as well as the possible shape of the ship by looking at the one piece you find.
Last edited by Salty; 06-06-2005 at 08:54 AM.
06-06-2005, 09:45 AM
#4
I remember when I was taught evolution in High School, the teacher spent one hour (his whole timeslice with us for the day) discussing how evolution was just a theory and how learning about evolution didn't prove or disprove anything about theology or philosophy. As a self-styled man of science at that time, I kinda thought that day was ridiculious because we wasted so much time explaining what I thought was obvious.
I guess it isn't obvious to everyone, and that disappoints me.
I guess it isn't obvious to everyone, and that disappoints me.
06-06-2005, 10:28 AM
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I think evolution fits within theologic creationism to a major extent. Scientists still don't try to claim that they know how a piece of rock turned into life, but only the notion that life adapts itself into different forms. If you see how different species have adapted to their food supply, predators, etc, it isn't too hard to comprehend that those who can adapt will survive.
Personally, I believe that some intelligent design started it out, and part of that design was evolution.
I think parents are responsible for teaching their children about the religious perspective on the issue, and I think evolution education should steer clear of things that have not been scientifically proven.
On another note, evolution is a racist theory, is it not? Sounds divisive
Personally, I believe that some intelligent design started it out, and part of that design was evolution.
I think parents are responsible for teaching their children about the religious perspective on the issue, and I think evolution education should steer clear of things that have not been scientifically proven.
On another note, evolution is a racist theory, is it not? Sounds divisive
06-06-2005, 10:30 AM
#6
Originally Posted by HellaDumb
On another note, evolution is a racist theory, is it not? Sounds divisive
06-06-2005, 11:16 AM
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Originally Posted by nKoan
Well yeah, but those races aren't around anymore to complain, now are they?
Ahah, so how can we say equality = diversity, when diversity = differences.
06-08-2005, 10:44 AM
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Originally Posted by HellaDumb
On another note, evolution is a racist theory, is it not? Sounds divisive
Clearly your school didn't do a very good job of teaching evolution.
06-08-2005, 10:53 AM
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Originally Posted by MVWRX
Clearly your school didn't do a very good job of teaching evolution.
06-08-2005, 10:57 AM
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Originally Posted by HellaDumb
I think evolution fits within theologic creationism to a major extent.
Last edited by Peaty; 06-08-2005 at 11:00 AM.
06-08-2005, 12:01 PM
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Originally Posted by HellaDumb
Of course, we are ALL EXACTLY THE SAME. That's why diversity is perversity.
I do think it's rediculous that the evolution vs creation is even an issue though. Even if we make the assumption that both creationism and evolution are equally valid theorys to be tested, creationism would not be taught in a science class room because of the lack of evidence. We don't teach our children about theories that don't have evidence for them. Like this one paper I read about how water has a collective inteligence written by a Princeton prof. Yes, it's a theory. And this guy had some 'data' for it. But noone else could substantiate the evidence.
So, based on a reasonable requirement for evidence, creationism can be classified as an unproven theory, an unDISproven theory, but certainly a theory that is unfit for disemination in the context of a science class.
Using the exact same logic, evolution can be said to be the theory about our origins that has the most evidence for it and the least evidence against it. So it can be classified as an unproven theory, an undisproven theory, but certainly a theory that has been tested and retested to the point that it falls well within the realm of scientific information.
Last edited by MVWRX; 06-08-2005 at 12:08 PM.
06-10-2005, 06:15 PM
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I think religion should be saved as an elective for higher education, part of philosophy or mythology...lol.
Religion was created to control people. Not a bad thing. People do need to be controled to a certain extent.
When the unexplained happens it's either labled as a sign from God or the evil powers of satan. That is until our grasp of science catches up to us, then these mysteries are explained. That is how it's happened all throughout history. It all started with fire.
Religion was created to control people. Not a bad thing. People do need to be controled to a certain extent.
When the unexplained happens it's either labled as a sign from God or the evil powers of satan. That is until our grasp of science catches up to us, then these mysteries are explained. That is how it's happened all throughout history. It all started with fire.
06-10-2005, 07:03 PM
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Originally Posted by Chrisnonstop
I think religion should be saved as an elective for higher education, part of philosophy or mythology...lol.
Religion was created to control people. Not a bad thing. People do need to be controled to a certain extent.
When the unexplained happens it's either labled as a sign from God or the evil powers of satan. That is until our grasp of science catches up to us, then these mysteries are explained. That is how it's happened all throughout history. It all started with fire.
Religion was created to control people. Not a bad thing. People do need to be controled to a certain extent.
When the unexplained happens it's either labled as a sign from God or the evil powers of satan. That is until our grasp of science catches up to us, then these mysteries are explained. That is how it's happened all throughout history. It all started with fire.
Which part of it do you wish to ignore?
Last edited by HellaDumb; 06-10-2005 at 07:08 PM.
06-10-2005, 09:02 PM
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Originally Posted by HellaDumb
Which part of it do you wish to ignore?
06-10-2005, 10:14 PM
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All of it.
Originally Posted by HellaDumb
Well, often, people don't grasp true what is real and what matters until late in their lives. Are you saying that jesus is now some mythical being? More and more of what is in the bible is being and has been PROVEN by science and historical record.
Which part of it do you wish to ignore?
Which part of it do you wish to ignore?
Like I said though. Religion helps to control the masses. Keeps people in order. The bible tells people to live a good and kind life. That's not a bad thing. Fear Gods wrath. Be good or forever burn in hell. Hey, if I didn't know any better I'd be scared out of my wits about it. Apparently it works though. The churches in my town are located on some $$$prime$$$ realestate.