Impreza 2.5TS invoice price
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Impreza 2.5TS invoice price
Hi all,
I will soon be in the process of getting a MY04 Impreza 2.5TS wagon for our family (and for my own fun
). I'm curious to know what is the real invoice price the dealer pay to get them in CAD$ if we know the MSRP is 22995$.
Also, what is the % of price reduction for a MY04 which is slighty used (3000-5000 km) ?
I just need these info to use as a tool for negociating the price.
I will soon be in the process of getting a MY04 Impreza 2.5TS wagon for our family (and for my own fun
). I'm curious to know what is the real invoice price the dealer pay to get them in CAD$ if we know the MSRP is 22995$.Also, what is the % of price reduction for a MY04 which is slighty used (3000-5000 km) ?
I just need these info to use as a tool for negociating the price.
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Is those price in CAD$ ?? If yes, it was a big difference...
I expected around 19500 - 20000 ballpark.
Seems you are from Pittsburg so i think these amounts are in US$ so i will just try to get a percent then use in CAD$. I cannot use exchange rate because the canadian price is lower than the us one.
I expected around 19500 - 20000 ballpark.
Seems you are from Pittsburg so i think these amounts are in US$ so i will just try to get a percent then use in CAD$. I cannot use exchange rate because the canadian price is lower than the us one.
Last edited by Xilikon; Jan 23, 2004 at 09:39 AM.
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Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 168
From: Coquitlam
Car Info: 1985 Corolla AE82 FWD
sorry to jack the thread, but I'm also wondering kinda of "space" we buyers have to negotiate around. $22,995 is a lot of money for me.
In my area (in Canada), I've heard about some people only getting $1000 dollars of MSRP. That's the MOST I've heard, actually. Usually only like 500 dollars or something.
In my area (in Canada), I've heard about some people only getting $1000 dollars of MSRP. That's the MOST I've heard, actually. Usually only like 500 dollars or something.
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Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 44
I bought my 2.5TS in september.
I did my research, went on APA, and found that the markup for the 2.5TS is ~1600 CAD (don't remember the exact number but i'm within 100 bucks). I got an automatic so the MSRP was 24095, invoice was ~22495.
The auto to manual difference is about 1100 CAD so just subtract that much from the above numbers and you've got your approximate manual invoice price.
APA suggests you add on a 900 dollar markup on the invoice when buying from a dealer.
FYI, i got my car basically at invoice price. I paid 1300 under invoice + 2 free options worth about 300 bucks(cargo cover + armrest). I was lucky and had someone that referred me. I bought in toronto.
Hope this helps
I did my research, went on APA, and found that the markup for the 2.5TS is ~1600 CAD (don't remember the exact number but i'm within 100 bucks). I got an automatic so the MSRP was 24095, invoice was ~22495.
The auto to manual difference is about 1100 CAD so just subtract that much from the above numbers and you've got your approximate manual invoice price.
APA suggests you add on a 900 dollar markup on the invoice when buying from a dealer.
FYI, i got my car basically at invoice price. I paid 1300 under invoice + 2 free options worth about 300 bucks(cargo cover + armrest). I was lucky and had someone that referred me. I bought in toronto.
Hope this helps
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You should always make it your goal to get at least with in 500 of invoice. I don't know too much about the exchange rate for Canadian Currency, but you should never pay MSRP. I just got an 04 WRX here in Dallas, TX and the Final price at Drive out was 1000 USD less than MSRP (This includes tax title and license). I know it will be different for you, but IMO you should aim for a price as close to Invoice as possible. Also don't be afraid to leave. Don't just say it, I had a sales person drop the price by 1000 USD all because I stood up ready to leave and that made the sale for both of us. Its really true when they say actions speak louder than words. Good luck.
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It maybe a different ideal to selling cars in Canada. I know here in the US the only place where you actually pay sticker price is at Saturn. They are a haggle free place where they just set the price. Kinda like the grocery store or something... but most places I know you can deal. Autonation here is also a haggle free environment but my friend was able to lower the price when talking w/ them too. Those are the only places i know of however.
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No offence to those that pay it, but MSRP is for uninformed consumers.
after reading www.carbuyingtips.com , you'll realize that you can save a decent amount of money. Sometimes it doesn't make much sense since you are paying like 25000 bucks, what difference is 500 bucks right?
wel,,, that's a heck of a lot of gas, it's new tires, it's more options (not at dealer prices of course), it's insurance money, etc....
Seriously, the amount you pay above invoice is basically for the effort the salesman did in selling you the car... And if you walk into the dealership *already* knowing you want to buy a certain car, then what exactly HAS the salesman done? You already pay the mechanics in the back (PDI/Freight), you already pay for them to do administrative junk like plates and filling out forms (admin), you already pay gov. taxes... Does the salesman really deserve teh $1500 (or more) markup for being a yes man?
after reading www.carbuyingtips.com , you'll realize that you can save a decent amount of money. Sometimes it doesn't make much sense since you are paying like 25000 bucks, what difference is 500 bucks right?
wel,,, that's a heck of a lot of gas, it's new tires, it's more options (not at dealer prices of course), it's insurance money, etc....
Seriously, the amount you pay above invoice is basically for the effort the salesman did in selling you the car... And if you walk into the dealership *already* knowing you want to buy a certain car, then what exactly HAS the salesman done? You already pay the mechanics in the back (PDI/Freight), you already pay for them to do administrative junk like plates and filling out forms (admin), you already pay gov. taxes... Does the salesman really deserve teh $1500 (or more) markup for being a yes man?
Registered User
Joined: Aug 2003
Posts: 168
From: Coquitlam
Car Info: 1985 Corolla AE82 FWD
Originally posted by mr_yellow
Seriously, the amount you pay above invoice is basically for the effort the salesman did in selling you the car... And if you walk into the dealership *already* knowing you want to buy a certain car, then what exactly HAS the salesman done? You already pay the mechanics in the back (PDI/Freight), you already pay for them to do administrative junk like plates and filling out forms (admin), you already pay gov. taxes... Does the salesman really deserve teh $1500 (or more) markup for being a yes man?
Seriously, the amount you pay above invoice is basically for the effort the salesman did in selling you the car... And if you walk into the dealership *already* knowing you want to buy a certain car, then what exactly HAS the salesman done? You already pay the mechanics in the back (PDI/Freight), you already pay for them to do administrative junk like plates and filling out forms (admin), you already pay gov. taxes... Does the salesman really deserve teh $1500 (or more) markup for being a yes man?
I think there should be atleast a little bit of markup so atleast the sales person can make some money for doing the organizing for ya (instead of you having to talk to the manager yourself etc etc).
But yeah... 1500 is quite a bit.
I think only Toyota in Canada (atleast on the westcoast) has the issue where you pay MSRP only. Other places, I believe, you can haggle. But I keep hearing about US people getting "300 over invoice, etc etc etc"... but never CDN people? For us it's like "MSRP, MSRP + CD player, etc."
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I think it's a very arrogant thing to say mr yellow.
Originally posted by mr_yellow
Seriously, the amount you pay above invoice is basically for the effort the salesman did in selling you the car... And if you walk into the dealership *already* knowing you want to buy a certain car, then what exactly HAS the salesman done? You already pay the mechanics in the back (PDI/Freight), you already pay for them to do administrative junk like plates and filling out forms (admin), you already pay gov. taxes... Does the salesman really deserve teh $1500 (or more) markup for being a yes man?
I agree if you are in the States this is true. However, outside of the US things work differently. So whose to say the way they sell cars in Canada is the same as it is here. I'd ask other Canadian people around and find out how the system works for canadains to get a better idea of what kind of room you have to haggle w/ the dealers.
Originally posted by mr_yellow
Seriously, the amount you pay above invoice is basically for the effort the salesman did in selling you the car... And if you walk into the dealership *already* knowing you want to buy a certain car, then what exactly HAS the salesman done? You already pay the mechanics in the back (PDI/Freight), you already pay for them to do administrative junk like plates and filling out forms (admin), you already pay gov. taxes... Does the salesman really deserve teh $1500 (or more) markup for being a yes man?
I agree if you are in the States this is true. However, outside of the US things work differently. So whose to say the way they sell cars in Canada is the same as it is here. I'd ask other Canadian people around and find out how the system works for canadains to get a better idea of what kind of room you have to haggle w/ the dealers.
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It is a very arrogant thing to say. but i only say it out of experience. I was lucky enough to get "referred" through two independant seperate sources to get subaru car for "near invoice" (one of them being through a friend). And by comparing the quotes i got, I'd say the system in canada is exactly the same in the US. The numbers for my purchase are in the above post.
The dealerships rip into you in SO many ways it's not funny.
Markups on admin fees, markups on options, markups, on the car.... It's simply NOT fair.
If you're uninformed, you'll get a bad deal but the salesman will make it SEEM like it was a good deal... If you're informed, You'll get a better deal (but still not the best), and the salesman will still make it seem like it was a good deal...
This is what i went through:
walked into dealership. got a test drive, sat down to start negotiating.. The salesman was very nice but still very sneaky.
1) He only went down 800 under MSRP
2) The admin cost was 600 bucks
3) he quoted 300 bucks for armrest extension
4) he quoted me 600 bucks for the retractable cargo cover
5) he went as far as to go and talk with one of the mechanics to do an "after hours" install, so the foglights and cargo cover wern't charged labour
6) he showed me an edmunds.com printout with USD prices to show me what the "invoice" price was. He acted like what he was doing was "illegal" and he would get in toruble if his manager saw him. Of course, USD quotes are worthless since the conversion changes all the time and he ZIPPED through the calculations not giving me enought time to absorb it all. In the end, he said the invoice price was ~1200 under MSRP.
All in all, You'd think you were getting a good deal right? Save on labour, the guy showed me the invoice price, was going UNDER MSRP price...
so afterwards, I went online, talked to some friends, this is what i ended up with:
1) got offered 1300 under MSRP
2) admin free was 300 bucks
3) cargo cover was quoted as 200 bucks
4) armrest extension was quoted as 100 bucks
5) after a mix up with the price (I thought it was cheaper, when it wasn't, got me kinda pissed and feeling ripped off but it was an honest mistake), i looked like i was ready to walk, when the guy said "okay, how about i throw in the 2 options for free?"
6) he showed me that the invoice price was ~1600 under MSRP, which was more inline with what i got from APA.ca
In the end, i "saved" 1700 bucks over the other quote... but that's not what's important.
Note that the "admin fee" varied from dealership to dealership
Options have HUGE markups as well
Salesman use sneaky tactics
The salesmen i dealt with ALWAYS worked off of the MSRP price. they always tried to avoid saying and working off of the invoice price.
the invoice price really isn't the real invoice price.
Eitherway, you walk out of both situations thinking you got a good deal. That's what a good salesman does. like I said, a "yes man".
Anyways, the point is, the system in canada is the same if not similar to the way the US system works.
Dealer gets the car from manufacturer for price X
Dealer tells consumer invoice price of car is price Y
Dealer sells car for price Z
X < Y < Z
and i'm canadian btw... live in toronto, purchased just last september.
Edit: forgot to mention, my above experience is pretty much exactly what you'll read on www.carbuyingtips.com
so go read it!
The dealerships rip into you in SO many ways it's not funny.
Markups on admin fees, markups on options, markups, on the car.... It's simply NOT fair.
If you're uninformed, you'll get a bad deal but the salesman will make it SEEM like it was a good deal... If you're informed, You'll get a better deal (but still not the best), and the salesman will still make it seem like it was a good deal...
This is what i went through:
walked into dealership. got a test drive, sat down to start negotiating.. The salesman was very nice but still very sneaky.
1) He only went down 800 under MSRP
2) The admin cost was 600 bucks
3) he quoted 300 bucks for armrest extension
4) he quoted me 600 bucks for the retractable cargo cover
5) he went as far as to go and talk with one of the mechanics to do an "after hours" install, so the foglights and cargo cover wern't charged labour
6) he showed me an edmunds.com printout with USD prices to show me what the "invoice" price was. He acted like what he was doing was "illegal" and he would get in toruble if his manager saw him. Of course, USD quotes are worthless since the conversion changes all the time and he ZIPPED through the calculations not giving me enought time to absorb it all. In the end, he said the invoice price was ~1200 under MSRP.
All in all, You'd think you were getting a good deal right? Save on labour, the guy showed me the invoice price, was going UNDER MSRP price...
so afterwards, I went online, talked to some friends, this is what i ended up with:
1) got offered 1300 under MSRP
2) admin free was 300 bucks
3) cargo cover was quoted as 200 bucks
4) armrest extension was quoted as 100 bucks
5) after a mix up with the price (I thought it was cheaper, when it wasn't, got me kinda pissed and feeling ripped off but it was an honest mistake), i looked like i was ready to walk, when the guy said "okay, how about i throw in the 2 options for free?"
6) he showed me that the invoice price was ~1600 under MSRP, which was more inline with what i got from APA.ca
In the end, i "saved" 1700 bucks over the other quote... but that's not what's important.
Note that the "admin fee" varied from dealership to dealership
Options have HUGE markups as well
Salesman use sneaky tactics
The salesmen i dealt with ALWAYS worked off of the MSRP price. they always tried to avoid saying and working off of the invoice price.
the invoice price really isn't the real invoice price.
Eitherway, you walk out of both situations thinking you got a good deal. That's what a good salesman does. like I said, a "yes man".
Anyways, the point is, the system in canada is the same if not similar to the way the US system works.
Dealer gets the car from manufacturer for price X
Dealer tells consumer invoice price of car is price Y
Dealer sells car for price Z
X < Y < Z
and i'm canadian btw... live in toronto, purchased just last september.
Edit: forgot to mention, my above experience is pretty much exactly what you'll read on www.carbuyingtips.com
so go read it!
Last edited by mr_yellow; Feb 22, 2004 at 08:28 PM.
Registered User
Joined: Sep 2003
Posts: 44
If you want to know what the "invoice" price is, to go www.apa.ca and sign up for membership. It costs money but it's worth knowing.
For a while, i was contemplating the idea that organizations like the APA and Edmunds.com etc, were working in conjunction with manufacturers and dealers to set an artificially high "consumer invoice price"...
I have no proof of this but it seems pretty plausible given the circumstances.
For a while, i was contemplating the idea that organizations like the APA and Edmunds.com etc, were working in conjunction with manufacturers and dealers to set an artificially high "consumer invoice price"...
I have no proof of this but it seems pretty plausible given the circumstances.