Street Racer causes death = 2nd degree MURDER?
02-02-2003, 02:06 PM
#17
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Won't bother me what somebody who street races thinks. I won't be the one in trouble when they get caught street racing. In some places the states seize your car and you don't get it back as well as the state taking points from your license for just being at a street race. The police and laws are closing in on street racing for a reason. Too many morons who refuse to see what they are doing is wrong or dangerous. Criminally negligent homicide is still a felony.
02-02-2003, 02:10 PM
#18
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I compare street racing with walking down the street blindfolded with a gun and once in a while shooting... you do not mean to kill anyone... but you definitely have the means to do it.
They did not intentionally mean to do it but because of their actions it occurred and now someone is dead because of it..
so for that reason I think the charges are fair.
Just my opinion though.
They did not intentionally mean to do it but because of their actions it occurred and now someone is dead because of it..
so for that reason I think the charges are fair.
Just my opinion though.
02-02-2003, 05:37 PM
#21
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You know I forgot to ask were the people involved simply charged with murder or are you saying that a grand jury said there is enough proof and legal standing to allow a charge of murder. Cause simply being charged with something isn't the same as a grand jury saying that it merits the charge or that its winable.
02-02-2003, 06:31 PM
#22
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Wasn't going to but feel I gotta put my .02 in.........
Those who street race, are negilgent and if they cause the death of innocent people, they sure should be charged with Murder.
The cheap ****ers deserver every second in jail they get.
Sure makes sense to me, that they (the racers) can spend a ton o' money "riceing" up there cars, but are too friggin cheap to spend the $20-$50 buck to go race somewhere (realatively) safe?
How would you who seem to think the 2nd degree murder charge is to stiff, feel if it was your Son/Daughter/Brother/Sister/Wife/Mother/Father who were killed by some dumbass street racer just cause they were too cheap to spend a little of their money to go race in a place where it is legal and the only person/people who might get hurt in the case of an accident are those directly involved in the race.
THROW THE BOOK AT EM!!!!!
My .02 like it or not!
Those who street race, are negilgent and if they cause the death of innocent people, they sure should be charged with Murder.
The cheap ****ers deserver every second in jail they get.
Sure makes sense to me, that they (the racers) can spend a ton o' money "riceing" up there cars, but are too friggin cheap to spend the $20-$50 buck to go race somewhere (realatively) safe?
How would you who seem to think the 2nd degree murder charge is to stiff, feel if it was your Son/Daughter/Brother/Sister/Wife/Mother/Father who were killed by some dumbass street racer just cause they were too cheap to spend a little of their money to go race in a place where it is legal and the only person/people who might get hurt in the case of an accident are those directly involved in the race.
THROW THE BOOK AT EM!!!!!
My .02 like it or not!
02-02-2003, 07:15 PM
#23
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I agree with your 2 cents.
There are lots of places they could have gone.. but they diddn't that was their choice and they will pay for it.
If it was my son and daughter in that car... I would want more than life in prison... I would want their life... not like I would get it but that is how I would feel.
There are lots of places they could have gone.. but they diddn't that was their choice and they will pay for it.
If it was my son and daughter in that car... I would want more than life in prison... I would want their life... not like I would get it but that is how I would feel.
02-02-2003, 11:13 PM
#24
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Location: Atlanta, GA
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I'll throw my 2 cents in. I think this charge is ridiculous. You may disagree with street racing (I DON'T) but to equate an accident with murder is insane. To ME making a mistake and having someone die from it should not be murder. I do think there are legal grounds to at least try it on though.
JC
JC
02-03-2003, 03:01 AM
#25
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The way I see it street racing is a misdameaner so is speeding.To say I'm going with the flow of traffic or everybody else is doing it is no excuse.The law is set up to protect people from over zealous people like you.They will go to jail for along time either way. The only differance is how long.
02-03-2003, 01:11 PM
#26
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Originally posted by optimalrage
The way I see it street racing is a misdameaner so is speeding.
The way I see it street racing is a misdameaner so is speeding.
"They did not INTEND to kill anyone. The deaths were not caused willfully or deliberately."
They willfully and deliberately engaged in a speed contest which a reasonable person can expect to result in a fatality or serious injury.
I'm not convinced that this equates to 2nd degree murder, but I also believe anyone responsible for a death resulting in street racing should never be allowed to legally drive again. They have proven themselves not to be trusted with such a responsibility.
It's time we stop handing out driver's licenses like candy. Driver's should have to prove they can drive and understand that it is a serious activity not to be taken lightly.
02-03-2003, 02:23 PM
#27
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I disagree, even more so if the race was not premeditated, but I must say that in my opinion you make a **great point** and express it eloquently.
...unlike some of the people raving here with sweat in their eyes blathering on and on.
...unlike some of the people raving here with sweat in their eyes blathering on and on.
Originally posted by rotary4ever
I compare street racing with walking down the street blindfolded with a gun and once in a while shooting... you do not mean to kill anyone... but you definitely have the means to do it.
They did not intentionally mean to do it but because of their actions it occurred and now someone is dead because of it..
so for that reason I think the charges are fair.
Just my opinion though.
I compare street racing with walking down the street blindfolded with a gun and once in a while shooting... you do not mean to kill anyone... but you definitely have the means to do it.
They did not intentionally mean to do it but because of their actions it occurred and now someone is dead because of it..
so for that reason I think the charges are fair.
Just my opinion though.
02-03-2003, 02:40 PM
#28
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You are arguing against yourself when you say "throw the book at em" if we keep to the original intent of this thread (which I posted).
Throwing the book at em means the most serious manslaughter charge, not a murder charge. I don't think anyone here is pushing for leniency.
But abusing the law through bench legislation hurts everyone and screws up the system.
If street racing deaths should be tried as murder, the law should say so. There is a process for making laws in this country and we are part of it.
But the process is not for a DA and a judge to make their own laws.
How'd you like it if a crazy judge sent you to jail for running over a cat because he was a cat lover? Granted, the analogy is a stretch, the point is made. Judges and DA's cannot arbitrarily change or make the law. Such abuse is dangerous. The country is not ruled by emotion. It's called RULE OF LAW.
Throwing the book at em means the most serious manslaughter charge, not a murder charge. I don't think anyone here is pushing for leniency.
But abusing the law through bench legislation hurts everyone and screws up the system.
If street racing deaths should be tried as murder, the law should say so. There is a process for making laws in this country and we are part of it.
But the process is not for a DA and a judge to make their own laws.
How'd you like it if a crazy judge sent you to jail for running over a cat because he was a cat lover? Granted, the analogy is a stretch, the point is made. Judges and DA's cannot arbitrarily change or make the law. Such abuse is dangerous. The country is not ruled by emotion. It's called RULE OF LAW.
Originally posted by Rotorflyr
Wasn't going to but feel I gotta put my .02 in.........
Those who street race, are negilgent and if they cause the death of innocent people, they sure should be charged with Murder.
The cheap ****ers deserver every second in jail they get.
Sure makes sense to me, that they (the racers) can spend a ton o' money "riceing" up there cars, but are too friggin cheap to spend the $20-$50 buck to go race somewhere (realatively) safe?
How would you who seem to think the 2nd degree murder charge is to stiff, feel if it was your Son/Daughter/Brother/Sister/Wife/Mother/Father who were killed by some dumbass street racer just cause they were too cheap to spend a little of their money to go race in a place where it is legal and the only person/people who might get hurt in the case of an accident are those directly involved in the race.
THROW THE BOOK AT EM!!!!!
My .02 like it or not!
Wasn't going to but feel I gotta put my .02 in.........
Those who street race, are negilgent and if they cause the death of innocent people, they sure should be charged with Murder.
The cheap ****ers deserver every second in jail they get.
Sure makes sense to me, that they (the racers) can spend a ton o' money "riceing" up there cars, but are too friggin cheap to spend the $20-$50 buck to go race somewhere (realatively) safe?
How would you who seem to think the 2nd degree murder charge is to stiff, feel if it was your Son/Daughter/Brother/Sister/Wife/Mother/Father who were killed by some dumbass street racer just cause they were too cheap to spend a little of their money to go race in a place where it is legal and the only person/people who might get hurt in the case of an accident are those directly involved in the race.
THROW THE BOOK AT EM!!!!!
My .02 like it or not!
02-03-2003, 05:10 PM
#29
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So in this case who came up with the charge and did they already provide enough evidence to support it to a grand jury? The law is sometimes left to interpretation since it wouldn't be practical to write a seperate statute for every possible scenario. Often times laws are written and come into practice based on an event. Meagans Law, the CA anti-stalking laws, laws that deny profit from crime like when a serial killer sells their story. Now the Van Dam family is trying to get another law pushed through in regards to the kidnap and murder of their daughter. A loophole currently forces the state to prove that the person who was caught for the murder was also the person who kidnapped the girl. They are trying to close that loophole. In the end the kids lives are more or less over cause either way they will have a felony record and spend some time in prison. The people who will have the final say will be the state supreme court and then the US supreme court if they even decide to hear the case.
Something else worth noting is that two years ago the US Supreme court said its actually legal for an officer to arrest you for a crime that is only punishable by a fine. A woman was arrested in Texas for not wearing a seatbelt and the court upheld the decision. So its possible to be arbitrarily arrested.
Something else worth noting is that two years ago the US Supreme court said its actually legal for an officer to arrest you for a crime that is only punishable by a fine. A woman was arrested in Texas for not wearing a seatbelt and the court upheld the decision. So its possible to be arbitrarily arrested.
02-03-2003, 05:29 PM
#30
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Interesting points N/A, but almost non-sequitor.
Being "arbitrarily" charged with murder and arbitrarily arrested for not wearing your seatbelt are worlds apart. An arrest and a conviction are two different concepts.
By the way, here's the URL to the article everyone...
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/m...m31waller.html
Being "arbitrarily" charged with murder and arbitrarily arrested for not wearing your seatbelt are worlds apart. An arrest and a conviction are two different concepts.
By the way, here's the URL to the article everyone...
http://www.signonsandiego.com/news/m...m31waller.html
Originally posted by N/A
So in this case who came up with the charge and did they already provide enough evidence to support it to a grand jury? The law is sometimes left to interpretation since it wouldn't be practical to write a seperate statute for every possible scenario. Often times laws are written and come into practice based on an event. Meagans Law, the CA anti-stalking laws, laws that deny profit from crime like when a serial killer sells their story. Now the Van Dam family is trying to get another law pushed through in regards to the kidnap and murder of their daughter. A loophole currently forces the state to prove that the person who was caught for the murder was also the person who kidnapped the girl. They are trying to close that loophole. In the end the kids lives are more or less over cause either way they will have a felony record and spend some time in prison. The people who will have the final say will be the state supreme court and then the US supreme court if they even decide to hear the case.
Something else worth noting is that two years ago the US Supreme court said its actually legal for an officer to arrest you for a crime that is only punishable by a fine. A woman was arrested in Texas for not wearing a seatbelt and the court upheld the decision. So its possible to be arbitrarily arrested.
So in this case who came up with the charge and did they already provide enough evidence to support it to a grand jury? The law is sometimes left to interpretation since it wouldn't be practical to write a seperate statute for every possible scenario. Often times laws are written and come into practice based on an event. Meagans Law, the CA anti-stalking laws, laws that deny profit from crime like when a serial killer sells their story. Now the Van Dam family is trying to get another law pushed through in regards to the kidnap and murder of their daughter. A loophole currently forces the state to prove that the person who was caught for the murder was also the person who kidnapped the girl. They are trying to close that loophole. In the end the kids lives are more or less over cause either way they will have a felony record and spend some time in prison. The people who will have the final say will be the state supreme court and then the US supreme court if they even decide to hear the case.
Something else worth noting is that two years ago the US Supreme court said its actually legal for an officer to arrest you for a crime that is only punishable by a fine. A woman was arrested in Texas for not wearing a seatbelt and the court upheld the decision. So its possible to be arbitrarily arrested.