STi: On-track and in Real Life
11-01-2003, 03:53 PM
#1
Guest
Posts: n/a
STi: On-track and in Real Life
STi on the fly...
"The Nuclear Blueberry" or, one "seriously fast bowl of rice".
Life with STi after 5 months of play:
The Stock Tires are simply disappointing. They aren't good at anything but looking good. Noisy and harsh on the road... Easily overheated and under-capable when pushed hard. The big flat tread blocks that look so track-worthy chunked-out at Summit Point WV and the car understeered like a station wagon. The ride is many times more harsh than that of a standard WRX. The dense seat foam takes the pounding ride and amplifies it. Stock tires are unacceptably noisy, period.
For as aggressive feeling as the car is, the suspension seems like it could be better on track. Rather smallish sway bars allow for a great deal of leaning body motion. I mean it REALLY leans (even after changing to more aggressive springs). If you are going to track it much, sway bars will eventually be required to get the most out of the car and the tires.
You just have to accept that the car is harsh... in exchange for the level of performance, which is considerable. More on that below.
Torque! Oh, did I mention the torque?
Holy-s!$% (like V8) torque awaits in every gear. Just try to get more than 16 MPG in the car under normal conditions...
You can't keep your foot out of it. The acceleration is just too rewarding. Gear box and shifter are joys to work. Transmission shifts easily without clutch if you match the revs with skill.
To haul this missile back down, the Brembo brakes are great. Stock pads are Brembo units that are pretty darn effective, but wear quickly in on-track use. After a total of 2 track events, I bought a set of replacement stock pads... Ouch. Over 320.00 for the fronts and about 315.00 for the rears.
Why the heck did I get the OE replacement brake pads at that price? Well, no other manufacturer except those ***-clowns who make redstuff and greenstuff have pads that fit the car (as of one month ago). Mitsubishi Evo VIII Pads are different thickness, but same backing plate. Don't know about the Nissan 350Z "Track" model's Brembos. Another good reason to stick with the stock pads are the EXPENSIVE and Lightweight BBS 17"x7.5" Forged Wheels (17 lbs each!) have a finish that I do not want to expose to nasty Track-oriented brake pads such as Hawk or more aggressive Porterfields. The stock pads yield only an easy to clean and non-corrosive dust that doesn't hurt the wheels. The BBS wheels are well over 700.00 a piece to replace. Yikes.
Early on I started to sour on the car based on the stock Tires and the first track experience... But with 4 decent tires and a set of Subaru's more aggressive "Spec C" springs, it is a whole different ball game as a track capable toy/commuter. For the second track event, I wanted to try the Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tires in the stock 225/45/17, in combination with the above springs. The PINK STI Spec C spring lower the car about 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch, making the ride height look a bit more aggressive. Believe it or not, the Michelin Track tires have more compliant (and therefore comfortable) sidewalls than the iron Bridgestones. The Michelins are designed to be a street legal tire that can be driven to and from the race track, as well as ON it.
With this combo, I took the car to Pocono North course with Delaware Valley BMW CCA. I ran the instructor group in the wet on Saturday and the dry on Sunday. Heh heh. The car redeemed itself significantly. Pilot Sport Cups are NOT known for being rain tires. Compound is effective, but minimal tread depth means standing water is a problem.
Wet or dry, only ONE competition-engined 95 M3 Lightweight passed me on the entire weekend. 911 RS America, several 2.5L E30 M3s, other E36 M3 Instructor cars, and everyone else in instructors group got BLOWN OFF by "the Blueberry". I really did learn to drive it in the wet, and then the dry. The car is hyper-capable. My friend Jeff in the fast 911 said "just wait for the dry, and then we'll see". He was right, I blew him off in the dry on the second lap of the morning session, badly.
My only real competition was my pal Mark Wharton (from Car Guys days), who arrived in his modified Firebird Formula. I've never out run him before, but the Subaru walked clear away after he finally let me by on the NASCAR bowl on the North Course.
DCCD in manual (to 65% rear) allows one to powerslide the rear, throttle-steer, and act like a total rear-wheel drive hooligan. Sideways? Straighten the wheel a bit, accelerate harder, and wait for the car come back into shape! Hilarious. It CAN NOT be done on the street. You have to push the car TOO HARD to get it to break away. This aggression on public roads will not be acceptable.
Continued... Next Post
"The Nuclear Blueberry" or, one "seriously fast bowl of rice".
Life with STi after 5 months of play:
The Stock Tires are simply disappointing. They aren't good at anything but looking good. Noisy and harsh on the road... Easily overheated and under-capable when pushed hard. The big flat tread blocks that look so track-worthy chunked-out at Summit Point WV and the car understeered like a station wagon. The ride is many times more harsh than that of a standard WRX. The dense seat foam takes the pounding ride and amplifies it. Stock tires are unacceptably noisy, period.
For as aggressive feeling as the car is, the suspension seems like it could be better on track. Rather smallish sway bars allow for a great deal of leaning body motion. I mean it REALLY leans (even after changing to more aggressive springs). If you are going to track it much, sway bars will eventually be required to get the most out of the car and the tires.
You just have to accept that the car is harsh... in exchange for the level of performance, which is considerable. More on that below.
Torque! Oh, did I mention the torque?
Holy-s!$% (like V8) torque awaits in every gear. Just try to get more than 16 MPG in the car under normal conditions...
You can't keep your foot out of it. The acceleration is just too rewarding. Gear box and shifter are joys to work. Transmission shifts easily without clutch if you match the revs with skill.
To haul this missile back down, the Brembo brakes are great. Stock pads are Brembo units that are pretty darn effective, but wear quickly in on-track use. After a total of 2 track events, I bought a set of replacement stock pads... Ouch. Over 320.00 for the fronts and about 315.00 for the rears.
Why the heck did I get the OE replacement brake pads at that price? Well, no other manufacturer except those ***-clowns who make redstuff and greenstuff have pads that fit the car (as of one month ago). Mitsubishi Evo VIII Pads are different thickness, but same backing plate. Don't know about the Nissan 350Z "Track" model's Brembos. Another good reason to stick with the stock pads are the EXPENSIVE and Lightweight BBS 17"x7.5" Forged Wheels (17 lbs each!) have a finish that I do not want to expose to nasty Track-oriented brake pads such as Hawk or more aggressive Porterfields. The stock pads yield only an easy to clean and non-corrosive dust that doesn't hurt the wheels. The BBS wheels are well over 700.00 a piece to replace. Yikes.
Early on I started to sour on the car based on the stock Tires and the first track experience... But with 4 decent tires and a set of Subaru's more aggressive "Spec C" springs, it is a whole different ball game as a track capable toy/commuter. For the second track event, I wanted to try the Michelin Pilot Sport Cup tires in the stock 225/45/17, in combination with the above springs. The PINK STI Spec C spring lower the car about 1/2 to 3/4 of an inch, making the ride height look a bit more aggressive. Believe it or not, the Michelin Track tires have more compliant (and therefore comfortable) sidewalls than the iron Bridgestones. The Michelins are designed to be a street legal tire that can be driven to and from the race track, as well as ON it.
With this combo, I took the car to Pocono North course with Delaware Valley BMW CCA. I ran the instructor group in the wet on Saturday and the dry on Sunday. Heh heh. The car redeemed itself significantly. Pilot Sport Cups are NOT known for being rain tires. Compound is effective, but minimal tread depth means standing water is a problem.
Wet or dry, only ONE competition-engined 95 M3 Lightweight passed me on the entire weekend. 911 RS America, several 2.5L E30 M3s, other E36 M3 Instructor cars, and everyone else in instructors group got BLOWN OFF by "the Blueberry". I really did learn to drive it in the wet, and then the dry. The car is hyper-capable. My friend Jeff in the fast 911 said "just wait for the dry, and then we'll see". He was right, I blew him off in the dry on the second lap of the morning session, badly.
My only real competition was my pal Mark Wharton (from Car Guys days), who arrived in his modified Firebird Formula. I've never out run him before, but the Subaru walked clear away after he finally let me by on the NASCAR bowl on the North Course.
DCCD in manual (to 65% rear) allows one to powerslide the rear, throttle-steer, and act like a total rear-wheel drive hooligan. Sideways? Straighten the wheel a bit, accelerate harder, and wait for the car come back into shape! Hilarious. It CAN NOT be done on the street. You have to push the car TOO HARD to get it to break away. This aggression on public roads will not be acceptable.
Continued... Next Post
11-01-2003, 03:56 PM
#2
Guest
Posts: n/a
Coninued from Previous (due to length)
She uses about 1/3 to 1/2 a tank of fuel for every run session at a track event! On right hand bends, don't let the gauge get much below 1/2, or you will lose the fuel pickup in the tank. It shut down at 115 MPH in 5th gear once when this happened! It restarted in some sort of limp mode where dash lights were flashing like we fried its brain... Only disconnecting the battery was required to get the car to return to running normally after that. It was smart to shut it down when it sensed NO FUEL. Could have been bad if the car wasn't so smart.
For what it is, The STi is expensive, fast and harsh.
They aren't selling as quickly now because the are slightly out of reach to the target audience and the initial hub-bub is mellowing. Through the grapevine, other (older) owners who wanted the speed have sold 'em because they are too rude for the daily commute. By contrast, rear seat padding is normal stuff from a WRX, so even mothers in law think that the car is normal from the back seat.
If using it in the winter, you're going to need a set of some decent A/S tires at minimum.
I've chosen to remain with (expensive) Michelins in the form of 225/45/17 Pilot Sport A/S tires that don't hurt the dry road performance. In fact, they are quite nice, and on this car, probably gives up very little to other high performance street tires. To date, The TireRack hasn't been able to find more than one set of (ugly) wheels that fit over the big front Brembos. The aftermarket is lagging behind on this.
Conclusion:
Ultimately worth the hassle in the right hands, if you are going to drive it aggressively. Innocent bystanders can't understand why you would put up with such a rascal of an automobile, with such a bold and overstated styling package. Every kid from her to Bayonne wants to race or chat with you about it... You'll find renewed popularity with dumb young punks in cars with FARTCANS.
On the "winter-ready" tires, the car is reasonably compliant. I've got some boom-boom in the trunk, and I'm cozying in for the long haul. The vibrating hood and rear wing will continue to remind me that this is no BMW. The practicality is nice and meaningful. Can't wait for winter now that I have tires with useful tread... It should be a blast to play Petter Solberg in the snow.
Hope this helps...
She uses about 1/3 to 1/2 a tank of fuel for every run session at a track event! On right hand bends, don't let the gauge get much below 1/2, or you will lose the fuel pickup in the tank. It shut down at 115 MPH in 5th gear once when this happened! It restarted in some sort of limp mode where dash lights were flashing like we fried its brain... Only disconnecting the battery was required to get the car to return to running normally after that. It was smart to shut it down when it sensed NO FUEL. Could have been bad if the car wasn't so smart.
For what it is, The STi is expensive, fast and harsh.
They aren't selling as quickly now because the are slightly out of reach to the target audience and the initial hub-bub is mellowing. Through the grapevine, other (older) owners who wanted the speed have sold 'em because they are too rude for the daily commute. By contrast, rear seat padding is normal stuff from a WRX, so even mothers in law think that the car is normal from the back seat.
If using it in the winter, you're going to need a set of some decent A/S tires at minimum.
I've chosen to remain with (expensive) Michelins in the form of 225/45/17 Pilot Sport A/S tires that don't hurt the dry road performance. In fact, they are quite nice, and on this car, probably gives up very little to other high performance street tires. To date, The TireRack hasn't been able to find more than one set of (ugly) wheels that fit over the big front Brembos. The aftermarket is lagging behind on this.
Conclusion:
Ultimately worth the hassle in the right hands, if you are going to drive it aggressively. Innocent bystanders can't understand why you would put up with such a rascal of an automobile, with such a bold and overstated styling package. Every kid from her to Bayonne wants to race or chat with you about it... You'll find renewed popularity with dumb young punks in cars with FARTCANS.
On the "winter-ready" tires, the car is reasonably compliant. I've got some boom-boom in the trunk, and I'm cozying in for the long haul. The vibrating hood and rear wing will continue to remind me that this is no BMW. The practicality is nice and meaningful. Can't wait for winter now that I have tires with useful tread... It should be a blast to play Petter Solberg in the snow.
Hope this helps...
11-01-2003, 06:15 PM
#3
Yeah, You've Probably Never Heard Of Me.
iTrader: (21)
Join Date: Sep 2003
Location: in a glass case of emotion.
Posts: 17,962
Car Info: 345/30/19s
Wow, great post!
Ive heard others comment on the firm ride and I gotta ask, am I the only one here who was not surprised by the ride quality? Im not by any means trying to sound "macho" or anything but I commute heavily in this car(6K miles since 9/12
) and the ride doesnt bother me one bit, even with the firmer H&R springs I installed, as a matter of fact I wouldnt want the ride or the seats any softer, then again maybe my butts just getting a bit softer
Ive heard others comment on the firm ride and I gotta ask, am I the only one here who was not surprised by the ride quality? Im not by any means trying to sound "macho" or anything but I commute heavily in this car(6K miles since 9/12
) and the ride doesnt bother me one bit, even with the firmer H&R springs I installed, as a matter of fact I wouldnt want the ride or the seats any softer, then again maybe my butts just getting a bit softer
Last edited by Krinkov; 11-01-2003 at 10:40 PM.
11-01-2003, 10:36 PM
#4
Guest
Posts: n/a
Thanks, it is fun recounting the adventures.
I would say the the complaining about overall rudeness falls within the realm of acceptable compromise... Even starting with a high tolerance for harshness in order to achieve high performance, the car was suprisingly rowdy. It is cool that Subaru released such an edgey car in the conservative American market.
The STi is at the start of a revolution of extreme performance cars in the hands of the public. I hope that the STi and the Evo one-up each other wildly in years to come.
- Dave
I would say the the complaining about overall rudeness falls within the realm of acceptable compromise... Even starting with a high tolerance for harshness in order to achieve high performance, the car was suprisingly rowdy. It is cool that Subaru released such an edgey car in the conservative American market.
The STi is at the start of a revolution of extreme performance cars in the hands of the public. I hope that the STi and the Evo one-up each other wildly in years to come.
- Dave
11-03-2003, 02:17 PM
#5
Registered User
Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: San Mateo, CA
Posts: 290
Car Info: 2007 Mazdaspeed 3
What are these 'Spec C' springs he mentions? And where can I get some? *grin*
11-04-2003, 12:41 AM
#8
Guest
Posts: n/a
That was an excelent post which affirms my belief that I purchased the right vehicle.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Last edited by bao ling; 11-04-2003 at 04:00 PM.
11-04-2003, 09:20 PM
#11
Guest
Posts: n/a
I recently put a set of Michellin Pilot A/S tires on my car and I will say this, the RE070's handled SO much better then the Michellin's. The Pilot Sport A/S are supposed to give up very little when it comes to handling for and A/S tire. If that is true I'd really hate to have an A/S sport tire that has "compromised handling."
11-05-2003, 04:54 PM
#12
Registered User
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: LA
Posts: 94
I like those RE070s but too bad I finished them off within 3 months. I have RE040s on now and the handling is totally different due to the softer sidewall but you can tell the DCCD and diffs doing their work. Interesting review there Btw, check out www.importhookup.com they have a list of wheels that will fit our STis. Mention my screen name and ask for Tim.
Btw, check out www.importhookup.com they have a list of wheels that will fit our STis. Mention my screen name and ask for Tim.
11-05-2003, 05:34 PM
#13
Registered User
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: up in my hizzy
Posts: 30
Car Info: Blue sedan WRX
STI vs. WRX
Have you taken a WRX to the track? how do they compare?
