in the long haul, perhaps, but NOT in the all important, initial impressions and grabbing people's attention.


Lemme break it down to you in terms that BAIC'ers will probably better appreciate......This is gonna sound really bad, but if you're (people are) honest.....

Fugly girl w/"GREAT personality"

or

HOT chick w/"who cares......"

Good luck trying to lure/sell the masses or more like "target audiences" w/the former!

 

**** that it looks like a tiburon with a freakin bmw logo

 

I like the Tiburon's styling... I guess none of you know that it was done by Pininfarina. (If you don't know who that is, you are teh lose in this discussion). What sucks about the Tiburon is that it's a Hyundai with a weak motor.

And the 2 series isn't "fugly" by any stretch. Not quite the classis beauty of the outgoing 3/5 series, but certainly not ugly.

It's more like "Girl-next-door charm without being super hot and has a good personality" compared to "hot chickwith... what was the other part again?" Which kind makes for better long term eh?

besides... this is an M car, not the 530i (blech). It IS all about performance.

 

not among subys

performance > looks

that's why i got my suby... now i've learned to love the bug eyes.

 

i like it, i think it looks awesome. with that sort of performance though, it could look pretty fugly before i'd have to say no to one.

someone confiscated Toyota's corporate ********* if they think thats true...

 

THAAAANK YOU!!! I was going to point that out ^^^^^, but didn't want to stir the pot any more or open up another can of worms. But IMO too, the M-Series hasn't been "all about performance" since the E-30 M3 went off to pasture!

Don't get me wrong....the E46 M3 and E49 M5 are still two of my favorite cars, but these recent BMW offerings---5 series, 6 series, Z4, just have me



btw, one of the reasons why I bought my bugeye WRX is for the fenders, which really reminded me of the E-30 M3's box flares. I LOVED that car, but could never find a clean one for a decent price! 2 of my buddies had them, but they're both greedy bastards!

 

you mean e39 m5 right?

 

nice try, but Suby folk are just crackpots!? yeah, I have one too!

 

Nah, it's a pure business decision. Toyota is now the second largest manufacturing concern in the world after General Motors. They don't feel that building performance cars like the old Supras and Celica All-Tracs make enough money to justify the expenditures for development costs and sponsoring race teams. Their F1 involvement is even less useful to them than the Taurs/Monte Carlo/Intrepids in Nascar are to the big 3.

 

Hey, if you put lipstick on a pig, it's still a pig. And if you put lipstick on a hot chick she's still hot. Or something. Point is, that stuff doesn't matter when the car goes like stink and handles awesome. Adding leather and power folding mirrors and other amenities won't detract from whatever performance it has. It's tight clothes on the lingerie model.

 

Show me a faster, better handling car with a back seat for less than what a new E46M3 costs and I'll tell you that you're right, it isn't all about performance. Closest there is is the G35, which is the first car in a long time to be better than the 3 series, but it's no M. We'll see what happens when the GT-R replacement shows up however.

 

different strokes for different folks, but I doubt anyone would go as far as to refer to any of the recent BMW designs as a, "hot chick" lingerie model."

Sure there are die hard performance/motoring nuts that will buy a car no matter how butt ugly it is if it will motor. But MANY more people are apt to pass on buying rides w/questionable styling, despite them being speed demons!

 

But that's the thing. To the average style-conscious buyer for whom performance isn't high on their list, there is no benefit to spending an extra $12k on an M car. The average person, rich or not, can't tell which was a 330ci and which was the M3 when they drive by. But blindfold an M car buyer and sit him in the passenger seat of each, and HE can tell you which is which. The whole point of what I've said in this thread is that in an M car, performance>styling. And that car will be fast. Besides, you can't POSSIBLY think that the 2 series, which looks a hell of a lot like the 2 door 3 series that it is, is as ugly as an M coupe.

(Also, I didn't call the 3 the lingerie model. The 3 is the girl you marry. The Lotus is the slutty model you keep on the side. )

 

i haven't been adding my comments just for the sake of being a jerk.....it's just that IMO, i really don't think recent M-Series buyers are all that performance-driven.

The majority of owners I see driving around are typical, corporate type$, and A LOT of middle aged women!! I don't want to generalize because I don't know their stories or backgrounds, but they don't strike me as the "all about performance" type of car buyers.

One of the reasons why BMW moved away from aggressively spec'd (suspended, styled, etc.) M cars like the E30 M3 is that the true performance buyers weren't buying enough of them. Going after the bigger fish, who just want to know they have a limited edition/top of the line car w/some extra juice to boot is much safer strategy. While it's arguable whether or not that tactic has paid off for BMW, they've stuck with it.

Having said that, it would be ideal if all M-Series or just performance car buyers, in general, were truly car/performance nuts, but I think those days are long gone. Times have changed, and there are a lot more Joe & Jane Schmoes that have hit the Lotto or cashed in on being entrepreneurs and are looking to blow some $$$ and something to floss. They are the ones, who are buying most of the M-Series and other "performance" cars.