Teh Politics Forum Rumors and lies and Teh Iraqi Info Minister and much much more...

Great Canadian Social Health Care!

Thread Tools
 
Search this Thread
 
Old 08-19-2009, 10:09 PM
  #16  
Registered User
Thread Starter
iTrader: (5)
 
iLoqin's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2003
Location: No Way
Posts: 6,826
Car Info: Nadda
Yea, you got it the way it should be, but there are a lot of unfortunate people who come with pre-existing conditions that others will not insure. I wish it was easier to be able to see health care areas as stores...

Look at Lasik and plastic surgery, sure for the first few years the market was expensive, but now it has dropped enormous amounts? Why? Because people are paying with their own $$, and they pick and choose to find which place is plausible and the best bargain. So ***** went from 15k to 6-7k. (not sure of that's a great estimate) but I do know that these things have dropped. Now lasik is maybe 1500 for both eyes? That's THE MARKET.

This is the way this should work...
Imagine a mall with stores of health care insurance companies, or just plain stores of health. Government says we'll give ALL places the same equal subsidy. The rest is up to you guys.

Say the cost of heart surgery was 10k.
Government provides 7k.
The stores can compete for the rest.

Store A says another 7g's. Comes with a full package and care and all of additions.

Store B says it's another 6G's. They explain what you get but it's missing a few things here and there, but to you it isn't really necessary.

Store C says it's 5.5g's. Shows benefits and things not included, doesn't look too good.

So then as a customer, you think well if the extra G is worth it, we'll do it. Maybe it includes a heart monitor, maybe it includes 3 follow ups through the year.

Maybe store 2 only has 2 check ups and doesn't include the monitor, maybe it has an emergency answering machine instead of a person.

Stuff like that should be easy and done by a job basis. I think that would help, as for all the immigrants and other people, it'd take me a long *** 20 page paper to see who is included and who isnt. =P But you get the jist.
iLoqin is offline  
Old 08-19-2009, 10:09 PM
  #17  
Registered User
 
Superglue WRX's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2006
Location: I was up above it, now I'm down in it
Posts: 5,686
Car Info: New Government Motors SUV!
We need more health care threads.
Superglue WRX is offline  
Old 08-19-2009, 10:12 PM
  #18  
VIP Member
iTrader: (17)
 
VRT MBasile's Avatar
 
Join Date: May 2005
Location: Sunnyvale, CA
Posts: 22,776
Car Info: '13 BRZ Limited / '02 WRX
Originally Posted by Superglue WRX
We need more health care threads.
VRT MBasile is offline  
Old 08-20-2009, 10:42 AM
  #19  
VIP Member
iTrader: (7)
 
wombatsauce's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Location: Stockholm
Posts: 7,441
Car Info: 2018 Golf R Variant
Originally Posted by ScoobySon
Just saying the system is chill. Go to school, learn something, get a job, make bank, pay for insurance, go get you eyes checked. Is it that hard?

Oh my god, not everyone has healthcare. It must be fate. It also must be fate that they cant afford $20 a month.
$20/ month? Wait what? My pops and his wife pay nearly $1k/month for their coverage. He is with Kaiser I believe. Used to be around $500/mo a few years ago. I saw those bills, have not confirmed the latest. He was dropped back in '04 when a doctor diagnosed him with potential prostate cancer and had a bunch of tests done. He faught to get coverage again, and I believe Kaiser is the only one who will touch him now. He does not have prostate cancer.

The man across the street from where I lived was a professional fisherman, with his own boat, and had been running this business for many years before I met him. He was 'between coverage' whilst going to a new provider back in 1995 and had a heart attack. He has since had to sell his boat/house/everything and he and his wife are still trying to pay off the debt. The will probably die with it.

My wife has been denied health care a couple times for a pre-existing issue. She never had any issues whatsoever getting help in her home country (Sweden) and in fact saves her Dr. and dentist visits for when we go there.

I guess I could go on, and on, and on, and on, but what would the point be?

Do any of you people know any old people? Have you asked them how they are being taken care of and how happy they are with their health care? Have you thought about how you will take care of yourself when you are old and retired? I am curious is all. It's so weird hearing real life expereinces from people in my life that directly contradict what I read here on a regular basis.

That being said, for some reason, now when I call my Dr. I can see her within a couple weeks where, back in 2002-2004 when I was getting MRIs and such for a spinal issue, I could never ever see her as she was booked solid for months in advance. In 4 years of having her as my "Primary Care Physician" I never saw her once in person. I can now make an appointment and get zero care much quicker than before. I was in a car accident and was shuffled around to 4 different specialists who suggested VIOXX which I was prescribed to and stopped taking once I heard on the radio that people were dying from it, then it was suggested that I get an epidural, and finally back surgery. After tossing around and riding in a couple MRI machines, seeing physical therapists and so much other crap, simply going to a yoga class once a week has COMPLETELY erased my issues. Glad I didn't have back surgery. Ah well... We are all victims of our own perception I guess.
wombatsauce is offline  
Old 08-20-2009, 11:55 AM
  #20  
Registered User
 
saqwarrior's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 1,808
Car Info: 2015 WRX
Originally Posted by iLoqin
We all know healthcare needs to be fixed. I am 100% positive we do not need a public option.
We don't need a public option or a government option? There's a difference.
saqwarrior is offline  
Old 08-20-2009, 11:56 AM
  #21  
Registered User
 
saqwarrior's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 1,808
Car Info: 2015 WRX
Originally Posted by ScoobySon
Just saying the system is chill. Go to school, learn something, get a job, make bank, pay for insurance, go get you eyes checked. Is it that hard?

Oh my god, not everyone has healthcare. It must be fate. It also must be fate that they cant afford $20 a month.
Wait until you have a pre-existing condition and see how easy it is for you to find health care at $20 a month.
saqwarrior is offline  
Old 08-20-2009, 11:58 AM
  #22  
Registered User
 
saqwarrior's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 1,808
Car Info: 2015 WRX
Originally Posted by iLoqin
Now lasik is maybe 1500 for both eyes? That's THE MARKET.
Dude, what? Where? It'll cost you $1300 in Europe, but everywhere I've found out here that's reputable will run about $4000. If you know someplace that's good that will do it for $1500, please share!
saqwarrior is offline  
Old 08-20-2009, 12:01 PM
  #23  
iClub Silver Vendor
iTrader: (25)
 
FW Motorsports's Avatar
 
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Participating in some Anarchy!
Posts: 15,494
Car Info: 2005 LGT wagon
Unless the scheme has changed, this is why I can not support BarryCare:

The current scheme being offered would have me pay for socialist health care that I would be excluded from using.
Which means I will have to keep my private health care plan.

And, I will be penalized for having my private health care plan.

How in the **** does that make any sense??
FW Motorsports is offline  
Old 08-20-2009, 12:10 PM
  #24  
VIP Member
iTrader: (4)
 
VRT Gump's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Yokosuka, Japan
Posts: 3,632
Car Info: 2008 EVO X/1991 Nissan Skyline GT-R32
This is yet another issue in this country that makes me happy to still be in the Military and going to Japan.
VRT Gump is offline  
Old 08-20-2009, 12:43 PM
  #25  
Registered User
iTrader: (2)
 
R-Dub's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Los Altos, CA
Posts: 2,585
Car Info: The Latest From WayneTech.
When President Obama recently cited the number of Americans without health insurance, he declared that, "We are not a nation that accepts nearly 46 million uninsured men, women, and children."

Uninsured patients often delay preventive care, waiting to seek medical attention only when their conditions worsen. This leads to more intensive treatment, often in the emergency department or hospital where costs run the highest.

Universal health coverage is therefore a sensible goal, and the reforms being considered all make considerable effort to provide everyone with affordable health care.

But expanding coverage cannot succeed as long as there remains a shortage of primary care clinicians.

After all, what good is having health insurance if you can't find a doctor to see you?

Massachusetts is often held out as a model for national health reform, and the bills being considered in Washington emulate much of that state's 2006 landmark universal coverage law. As a physician in neighboring New Hampshire, I have had the opportunity to observe the effect of the Massachusetts reforms.

Today, 97 percent of Massachusetts residents have health insurance, the highest in the country. But less publicized are the unintended consequences that the influx of half a million newly insured patients has had on an unprepared primary care system.

The Massachusetts Medical Society reported that the average wait time for a new patient looking for a primary care doctor ranged from 36 to 50 days, with almost half of internal medicine physicians closing their doors entirely to new patients. And when you consider that Massachusetts already has the highest concentration of doctors nationwide, wait times will likely be worse in other, less physician-abundant parts of the country, should universal coverage be enacted federally.

When patients are forced to wait weeks to obtain medical care, they inevitably find their way into the emergency department for treatment that ordinarily can be handled in a doctor's office. Indeed, since health reform was passed, according to state data provided to the Boston Globe, Massachusetts emergency rooms have reported a 7 percent increase in volume, which markedly inflates costs when you consider that emergency room treatment can be up to 10 times more expensive than an office visit for the same ailment.

Alwyn Cassil, a spokeswoman for the nonpartisan Center for Studying Health System Change, told HealthDay News that expanding coverage without improving access to care is a "recipe for failure," as well as unsustainable, "because it will just bankrupt us."

Massachusetts is finding out just how difficult it is to fiscally maintain universal coverage. In part due to soaring health costs, the state Legislature has proposed reducing health benefits for 30,000 legal immigrants and cutting funding to inner-city hospitals like Boston Medical Center, which, according to the Boston Globe, may "force it to slash programs and jeopardize care for thousands of poverty-stricken families."

The success of universal health coverage depends on an adequate supply of primary care providers. But the Association of American Medical Colleges is forecasting a shortage of 46,000 primary care physicians by 2025, a deficit that not only will balloon under any universal coverage measure, but cannot be made up as doctors, nurse practitioners and physician assistants all gravitate towards more lucrative specialty practice.

It's not only the financial incentives that need to substantially change for primary care to prosper. More important, the working conditions for the physicians already in the field have to improve. A recent survey in the Annals of Internal Medicine found that roughly half of primary care doctors reported practicing in a work environment "strongly associated with low physician satisfaction, high stress ... and [an] intent to leave."

Primary care clinicians routinely face unreasonable time pressures, a chaotic work pace, and bureaucratic impediments. Onerous paperwork requirements that obstruct patient care have to be reduced. And instead of the current system which encourages doctors to rush through as many office visits as possible, physicians who take the time to counsel, guide, and address all of their patients' concerns should be rewarded. Better valuing the doctor-patient relationship will increase satisfaction, not only for physicians, but for their patients as well.

Such solutions, however, have been largely absent from the health reform conversation.

Although it is a moral imperative for every American to have access to health insurance, alleviating the shortage of primary care providers is of equal importance. The prospect of suddenly adding tens of millions of patients to an overburdened primary care system has the potential to make the already dire state of American health care even worse.

The opinions expressed in this commentary are solely those of Kevin Pho.
A very well worded article that gives examples and reasons why UHC won't work. Not here, not now.

Is anyone else as scared as I am?
R-Dub is offline  
Old 08-20-2009, 12:44 PM
  #26  
Registered User
iTrader: (2)
 
R-Dub's Avatar
 
Join Date: Oct 2005
Location: Los Altos, CA
Posts: 2,585
Car Info: The Latest From WayneTech.
...

Last edited by R-Dub; 08-20-2009 at 12:45 PM. Reason: Double Post
R-Dub is offline  
Old 08-20-2009, 01:11 PM
  #27  
VIP Member
iTrader: (4)
 
VRT Gump's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Yokosuka, Japan
Posts: 3,632
Car Info: 2008 EVO X/1991 Nissan Skyline GT-R32
We need the resources before we put this into action. Just like the rest of the government - lets implement the change, then get the goods to have it work.
VRT Gump is offline  
Old 08-20-2009, 01:19 PM
  #28  
Registered User
iTrader: (4)
 
ScoobySon's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jan 2009
Location: Ann Arbor, MI
Posts: 809
Car Info: 2006 WRX STI
Get what you pay for.
ScoobySon is offline  
Old 08-20-2009, 01:23 PM
  #29  
VIP Member
iTrader: (4)
 
VRT Gump's Avatar
 
Join Date: Apr 2006
Location: Yokosuka, Japan
Posts: 3,632
Car Info: 2008 EVO X/1991 Nissan Skyline GT-R32
not always. because if you dont have enough to get, you still have to pay sometimes.
VRT Gump is offline  
Old 08-20-2009, 01:25 PM
  #30  
Registered User
 
saqwarrior's Avatar
 
Join Date: Jun 2008
Location: San Jose, CA
Posts: 1,808
Car Info: 2015 WRX
Originally Posted by Paul@dbtuned
Unless the scheme has changed, this is why I can not support BarryCare:

The current scheme being offered would have me pay for socialist health care that I would be excluded from using.
Which means I will have to keep my private health care plan.

And, I will be penalized for having my private health care plan.

How in the **** does that make any sense??
There are several proposed plans, and since none of them have been chosen yet, which one are you referring to?

And I'm curious about how you would be penalized for having a private plan?
saqwarrior is offline  


Quick Reply: Great Canadian Social Health Care!



All times are GMT -7. The time now is 12:51 AM.


Top

© 2024 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands



When you click on links to various merchants on this site and make a purchase, this can result in this site earning a commission. Affiliate programs and affiliations include, but are not limited to, the eBay Partner Network.