meilers

Before you say it, I DID read the sticky about pads...

I have an 02 WRX which is nearing 36k miles with absolutely no changes to the stock braking setup. I'd like your reccommendations for a stock size (no BBK yet) replacement setup that will have:

1) Better "bite" and postive feel than stock

2) JUST AS QUIET as stock -- no squeaks or squeals, I can't stand that in a car with so little soundproofing

3) A price under $400? Well, I can dream!

I don't care about dust from the pads, I have dark gray painted wheels. BTW, waxing your wheels with a synthetic wax REALLY HELPS with brake dust, I just hit them with a hose and they are clean, no adhesion problems.

I think I have decided on the Stoptech slotted OEM-size rotors, but I'm open to suggestions on lines, pads and fluid.

HellaDumb

iTrader: (3)

I recommend OEM pads. If yours lasted 36k then you don't likely need anything else. Stock pads last long, work well, and don't eat your rotors.

meilers

If I wanted to use the OEM pads, I wouldn't be asking I want to IMPROVE the braking system, not just maintain it.

Kevin M

iTrader: (12)

The StopTech rotors are a good deal. I'm running them front and rear on my RS, they're holding up well to Stoptech Club Spec front pads and Ultimates in the rear. I would guess that they would recommend Axxis Ultimates for you. They dust like crazy, but have good bite and make little noise. Plus they're very inexpensive.

Kevin M

iTrader: (12)

Yeah, there's not much advice about street pads in there. I'm working on that.

Kevin M

iTrader: (12)

The Stoptech slotted rotors are $200. $100 more for goodridge lines, Axxis Ultimates are $45. Couple bottles of SuperBlue and you're still under $400.

meilers

Thanks BAN, I'm definitely going to do a "Stoptech Stage II" when I do my exhaust and ECU in the Spring. Luckily the tuner shop I am going with is an authorized Stoptech dealer and installer. The Axxis pads do seem to be a better match for me than the Bobcats, as this car won't see any track time (I have part ownership of a purpose-built 944 Turbo for that :-) )...

Wingless Wonder

iTrader: (7)

Run a sticky summer or summer/rain tire for good handling and braking performance.

I like the Axxis Ultimate for street use. They are about as quiet as stock. I don't care about the dusting, either.

I'm using StopTech braided lines, front only, DBA 650-series slotted front rotors, with Motul RBF 600 fluid. The fade resistance is much better than the stock pads, as I've been able to fade the stockers with one hard application on a downhill grade. The stock brakes also faded badly after less than 10 minutes of very hard street driving by a hot shoe driver in Pleasanton CA. There are better track pads but for the money I'm sticking with Ultimates for now. My only real concern now are the stock front wheel bearings. After a track session, I could feel the heat dissipating off my front rotors while standing two feet away. I would eventually like to replace the front wheel bearings and have them packed with a good synthetic grease.

If I ever go with a larger than stock wheel/tire combination, I'll install the StopTech BBK.

--
0==WW==0
"…axles of evil…" - george w. bush

Damon

Would that hot shoe's name start with an S and end with a V?

I've got the Stoptech Stg. 2 and it's been working very well with my upgrades so far. Fade has been nonexistant so far.

meilers

Already have the tires/wheels sewn up; I've got 17" wheels and Goodyear F1 DS-G3s, I'm stuck to the asphalt like glue.

I'm curious, does altering the dynamics of the brake setup affect when and if ABS triggers? I've actually never had my ABS go off, not even during a panic stop at highway speeds (some moron let a WHEELBARROW fall out of the back of his pickup).

I second that opinion about the wheel bearings. I have replaced entire front axles in two other Subarus I have owned (a Loyale and a Legacy GL wagon) -- neither one was driven aggressively, but had total CV boot and bearing failures about 4 years into their lives.

Kevin M

iTrader: (12)

I'm not a fan of the GSD3s. Great street tires, but they roll over and die under high stress. Sticky on the street though.

As for ABS, changing brake torque will affect it (4 pots or rotor upgrades, like WRX->RS) but Stoptechs won't. They're properly engineered. Also,adding sticky tires changes ABS behavior, but usually for the better. The ABS *can* sometimes kick in when it doesn't need to, simply because the computer doesn't think you can possibly be slowing down THAT fast. That's rare though.

And, when I get around to my 6MT swap, I'll be changing and repacking all 4 bearings too just as a precaution.

Wingless Wonder

iTrader: (7)

Yes, to the hotshoe.

I think fade reduction is the best part of upgrades like StopTech and others using the stock wheel size. That was my goal, not so much a huge improvement in stopping power. Just wanted some consistency.

--
0==WW==0
"…axles of evil…" - george w. bush

Steppin Razor

iTrader: (5)

Please keep in mind that there is no such thing as a high performance street pad that will stand up to open track use on the front of a front engine car. So, unless you own a Porsche or a Ferrari, don't let me catch you at the track with a set of street pads.

With that having been said, here is a quick rundown of some quiet, high performance street pads:

Axxis Ultimate: Will make noise, especially at very low speeds and under low clamping loads, when not bedded in. Should be silent when properly bedded in thanks to integrated shims. Dusts as much as anything out there, however since the dust does not contain ferrous metals, it will not degrade the finish on wheels as long as you wipe them down every month or so. (For reference, I've gone over 6 months of hard street driving without cleaning my wheels, and had no damage to the finish of my wheels, but I do have Rotas. Cheesy stuff like Volks or Prodrive may not hold up as well. ) Ultimate exhibits excellent pad life and very low rotor wear characteristics when it is kept within its range of intended operating temperatures. Excellent fit and finish, with pad wear sensors where necessary. You'll have a tough time finding a street pad that this combination of low noise, good friction characteristics, long pad and rotor life, high MOT, and low price level as the Ultimate.

Axxis Deluxe Plus: Likely the least impressive friction characteristics of this bunch, certainly the least impressive MOT, but still an upgrade from stock and if you don’t beat the hell out of your car, you may not need the MOT that the other pads offer. These pads do have shims, but can make a little noise if they’re not bedded in. Keep them bedded and they’ll be silent. Same top notch fit and finish as Ultimate, with electronic wear sensors where necessary. The real benefit to these pads is the low dust levels, upgraded performance from OE, low pad and rotor wear rates, and pricing that’s roughly 25% less than that of Ultimate.

Hawk HPS: Damn near impossible to get this material to make noise. Certainly one of the quietest and lowest dusting HiPerf street pads around, with the possible exception of Hawk’s new Performance Ceramic compound. Gives up some in the MOT and friction level departments in order to reduce noise and greatly reduce levels of dust, but will still be an upgrade from OE pads. Compared to Ultimate, this material has almost no dust. Excellent pad and rotor wear characteristics and great fit and finish at a price that’s roughly twice that of Ultimate.

Hawk Performance Ceramic: I need to preface this one by saying that I have no personal experience with this compound since the knuckleheads at Hawk decided not to include the D372 pad shape in their first round of production. I have been told by Hawk that it will exhibit slightly better friction characteristics than HPS, have a similar MOT, have the same low noise, but with significantly less dust than HPS. Pricing is roughly 10% higher than that of HPS.

Pagid Sport Blue (RS 4-2-1 and RS 4-2-2): This pad is very similar in almost every way to Axxis Ultimate, except of course price. Great fit and finish, relatively high dust levels (not quite as high as Ultimate, but still substantial), low noise (shims included), great pad and rotor wear characteristics, SLIGHTLY (not significantly) better friction characteristics and similar MOT to Ultimate, but at roughly three times the price.

Tim Kelsch
StopTech LLC

meilers

Thanks, Tim. Stoptech rules -- the amount of knowledge you guys drop on this forum is astounding.

Hmm, sounds like I might want the Hawks -- since this is a street-only car that sees mostly highway miles, I might want to spend the extra cash and get something that will last a long time. My Kosei wheels (a TireRack-only model, for some reason) have a fantastic finish, they've held up for a full year with no stains or chips of any kind, but brake dust can be a drag...

BTW, since I have your attention, I've been reading the bedding-in procedure for new brakes and rotors, and I can't imagine where the hell I am going to find a road where I can actually go through that procedure (60-to-10mph, ten times without pausing) -- WTF?? Is there an easier way to do this, or something more applicable to an urban environment? I don't want to have to rent track time at Firebird just to bed my pads, nor do I want to get pulled over by Scottsdale PD for suspicion of being intoxicated