How many of the conservatives in this forum would be placidly accepting it if Kerry had won? Would you seriously have come here, said "good job liberals" and left it at that? Or wouldn't you have said that, in your opinion, we're all screwed? go on, tell me you wouldn't have been upset...

I would not. If the American public would have voted him in, I would have gone on with my life and deal with it

unlike yourself.. that is now posting all these threads to make yourself feel better :)

I hate them both, we're all screwed. :)

unlike yourself.. that is now posting all these threads to make yourself feel better :)

That's exactly what I'm doing. I'll be done soon. :p

Honestly, Scott is right. Now matter how soulless, corrupt and evil GWB is, he still can't kill America. He will most certainly try, but America is stronger then his ineptitude. :p


Seriously though, in reality GWB or Kerry wouldn't have changed much. Sure, I think Kerry had a chance at being slightly better, but in the end it really doesn't matter too much. Neither candidate was honestly different enough to bring about any sort of revolution (no matter how much some people seemed to want it).

Bush won, yay for Bush. Now cut my taxes. If I gotta put up with a Repub in the White House, I at least want lower taxes.

I would have accepted John Kerry in a heartbeat. Not because I liked him but because the people voted for him. This is the major difference between conservatives and liberals IMHO... Although I'm a moderate Republican by a long shot, I understand how the cookie crumbles and am not one to complain if I didn't get milk with that cookie.

I would have accepted John Kerry in a heartbeat. Not because I liked him but because the people voted for him. This is the major difference between conservatives and liberals IMHO... Although I'm a moderate Republican by a long shot, I understand how the cookie crumbles and am not one to complain if I didn't get milk with that cookie.

Thats a blanket statement that I don't think needs to be made. I'm a liberal, and while I'm not happy about Bush getting re-elected. I'm not whining. I'm just afraid for the country.

I agree with nKoan when he says there isn't a major difference and that Kerry may not have done much different. But the difference to me is the attitude. I hate Bush's "I'm not wrong and have never been" attitude and his cowboy swagger. He doesn't listen to anybody except his advisors and doesn't do well when told that he is wrong, as is evidenced by the first debate.

This scares me. I liked Kerry for this exact reason. He is known in the Senate to be a thinker and an intellect. I feel that this is the way a president should be. I'm not whining, but I am truly scared for our country.

Thats a blanket statement that I don't think needs to be made. I'm a liberal, and while I'm not happy about Bush getting re-elected. I'm not whining. I'm just afraid for the country.

You're foolish if you thought I meant every Tom, Dick and Harry liberal in the land. I too know some liberals that haven't complained in some pretty ****ty times. It's more of what i've been seeing this last 32hrs that's really put the icing on the cake. Just browse Nasioc's PP for 5 minutes to get the vibe... it's childish at best.

Heck, it wouldn't be the end of the world. It might bring about the end of the world, but not immediately =).

Just browse Nasioc's PP for 5 minutes to get the vibe... it's childish at best.

Hey, I went there once. Its "fun"

Had Kerry won, I would have accepted him as the elected President of this country...right/wrong, good/bad, he's the Boss.
'Cause in the end, whoever is the president really doesn't affect my life.

C'mon Oaf and Salty... be honest. You would have accepted Kerry simply because you would know in your heart his win would likely keep Hillary out of office. :p

-Chris

p.s. I like Hillary no more than any conservative, so Bush's win was a double (bad) whammy for me.

Ooooh...Hillary's sooo hot...same goes for her hot little trollop of a daughter...:eek:

Had Kerry won, I would have accepted him as the elected President of this country...right/wrong, good/bad, he's the Boss.
'Cause in the end, whoever is the president really doesn't affect my life.

Really? I guarantee you we'd have see an increase in income taxes accross the board, and higher gas taxes at the pump. We'd also watch what's left of our culture get shat on, and watch religion get removed from everything.

Think I'm wrong? The 50's american culture by today's standard is considered EXTREMISM!!! People are sick of liberals and their athiest agenda. Did you notice that Kerry got literally all of the athiest votes per exit polling? This stuff does affect your life. It's like boiling a frog to death.... it has no idea what is going on if you slowly raise the heat.

The mass media would make you think that Bush was the extremist, and that he represented a fringe minority regarding gay marriage. Now look what's happened. Even though BUSH is for civil unions, the outright ban of gay marriage and gay civil unions passed EASILY in 11 states.

Wake up, folks. Kerry didn't lose because he looks like Frankenstein.

C'mon Oaf and Salty... be honest. You would have accepted Kerry simply because you would know in your heart his win would likely keep Hillary out of office. :p

-Chris

p.s. I like Hillary no more than any conservative, so Bush's win was a double (bad) whammy for me.

Nope... not even in the slightest, Chris.

I actually think Democrats are in for another rude awakening if they think Hillary will win in 2008. Some Democrats may think this country is ready for a woman in office but I'd put all my money on the donkey party getting slammed by the vast majority of Christian, Catholics, LDS's and those that are for a more traditional family. Hell, I bet half of the Democratic party's men will follow suit and vote against her too because they’ll be damned if a woman is bringing home the bacon.

Nope... not even in the slightest, Chris.

I actually think Democrats are in for another rude awakening if they think Hillary will win in 2008. Some Democrats may think this country is ready for a woman in office but I'd put all my money on the donkey party getting slammed by the vast majority of Christian, Catholics, LDS's and those that are for a more traditional family. Hell, I bet half of the Democratic party's men will follow suit and vote against her too because they’ll be damned if a woman is bringing home the bacon.

Sadly I think he's right. The american people obviously aren't mature enough to deal with having a woman leader. The ego's are just to fragile

I agree. I honestly don't think (and I pray) that Hillary won't make it past the primaries.

-Chris

It's sad but true.

The electoral vote may have been reasonably close between Kerry and Bush but the difference in the popular was a joke. I'm sorry but it was... 3,500,000 voters was never expected to happen seeing how everyone expected a wave of young voters to vote Kerry & somehow dwarf the Republican vote etc etc. Most of these young voters stood up to their word and did vote for Kerry but the campaing somehow lost a lot of unexpected ground. It's already been admitted from the Democrats that their campaign somehow failed. Now imagine the first woman candidate in the history of the Presidency. It's laughable for both parties because of said ego.

The popular vote usually doesn’t matter but it does in this case because so much was predicted to happen that never ****ing happened with the Dem’s. If the Democrats want to see their candidate get elected in 2008 they're going need to revamp everything starting yesterday.

Most of these young voters stood up to their word and did vote for Kerry but the campaing somehow lost a lot of unexpected ground. It's already been admitted from the Democrats that their campaign somehow failed.

It's sad (to me, an agnostic) that the views of people so intrenched in religion that they ingnored the healthcare, economy, foreign policy and a multitude of non-religion issues and voted purely on faith.

I heard so many interviews on the news with Bush voters talking about how they voted for Bush because "God" would take care of the rest.

I would not. If the American public would have voted him in, I would have gone on with my life and deal with it

unlike yourself.. that is now posting all these threads to make yourself feel better :)
werd -

at least he's not like those crybabies i saw on t.v. - that said they are moving to canada if bush gets re-elected- i'm like... GO!
but thats okay... i still like monkeys :D






aloha from the summit of *-^-Mauna kea-^-*

It's sad (to me, an agnostic) that the views of people so intrenched in religion that they ingnored the healthcare, economy, foreign policy and a multitude of non-religion issues and voted purely on faith.

I heard so many interviews on the news with Bush voters talking about how they voted for Bush because "God" would take care of the rest.

I absolutely agree.

My Father married into my extremely religious step-family that was exactly the same. They relied on Jesus to cure my handicapped brother. It got so bad that I went off on every single one of them at the age of 16. I told then their views were a ****ing joke... I literally yelled that at them, got in my truck and drove off during Thanksgiving.

My Step-mom and Father are now divorced and aren't religious anymore because they also felt betrayed by religion. My brother is 14yrs old and still can't walk or talk... he bangs his head with the palm of his hand when he's hungry. Imagine how strong I feel on this issue and ask me if I believe in any of it.

I also feel the same on a handful of other Democratic/Liberal issues and people wonder why I get upset when I'm called a "flag-wearing" conservative.

im a democrat that voted republican, so i could have cared less both ways really...

like i said before i didn’t vote bush into office but i did vote for a second term, to me kerry wasn’t a democrat but a demorat and that’s why i didn’t vote for him

edgar, :)

im a democrat that voted republican, so i could have cared less both ways really...

like i said before i didn’t vote him into office but i did vote for a second term, to me kerry wasn’t a democrat but a democrat and that’s why i didn’t vote for him

edgar, :)


WHAT WHY?!?!? Kerry is a democrat!!! Tell me how he isn't?

Anyways this election scares the crap out of me honestly. I can get drafted IF it happens. (Yes salty i know, but im saying if because I believe if it gets worse over there something will have to be done. And I believed either Kerry or Bush would have to do it.) I'll start a seperate thread.

I absolutely agree.

My Father married into my extremely religious step-family that was exactly the same. They relied on Jesus to cure my handicapped brother. It got so bad that I went off on every single one of them at the age of 16. I told then their views were a ****ing joke... I literally yelled that at them, got in my truck and drove off during Thanksgiving.

My Step-mom and Father are now divorced and aren't religious anymore because they also felt betrayed by religion. My brother is 14yrs old and still can't walk or talk... he bangs his head with the palm of his hand when he's hungry. Imagine how strong I feel on this issue and ask me if I believe in any of it.


Let's just be clear that this sort of thing is not the norm for religious folks. Even MOST Christian Scientists do take their children to the doctor, and they are the ones who think diseases don't exist.

I would have accepted John Kerry in a heartbeat. Not because I liked him but because the people voted for him. This is the major difference between conservatives and liberals IMHO... Although I'm a moderate Republican by a long shot, I understand how the cookie crumbles and am not one to complain if I didn't get milk with that cookie.


So IYHO, generally all liberals are too radical to accept Bush as a president, but, on the other hand, all conservatives are generally moderate enough to accept a democratic president.

I'm not picking on you, Salty- that same thought crossed my mind (though vice-versa),

I ask you to please realize this: From a moderate point of view, the opposite moderate point of view will be more or less ignored, because there isn't a whole lot to disagree with. So, accordingly, moderate conservatives, like yourself, can only see the far-left, which they vehemently disagree with. And vise-versa, moderate democrats look over moderate republicans, only to see the other side as 'far-right.'

This flawed way of thinking only contributes to the polarization of our country, which I think is moving in the wrong direction. It is hard to see that this is the wrong direction to those of you with your party in power, but after losing an election, I, and many others on the left, have come to the realization that the left-right bickering needs to stop and we need to work to better our country as a whole. This would include uniting the people in support of the president. But, he must comethrough with his promise to work to gain the support of those who voted against him.

After wring this, I also thought of something very important:

Aways keep in mind that there are no clear-cut definitions for left, right, liberal, conservative, moderate, radical, and so on... Everything is realtive to one's own point of view. Everyone has a different 'center.' I think when we get into political discussions and arguments, the failure to realize this is a major problem. Since we have differnt definitions for the words we are using, it allows us to disagree and both feel correct. This leads to endless back-and-forth arguments, leading to nowhere whatsoever.

...just a thought

I think Kerry losing the election has made me start to think very logically...


can someone explain this?

My Father married into my extremely religious step-family that was exactly the same. They relied on Jesus to cure my handicapped brother. It got so bad that I went off on every single one of them at the age of 16. I told then their views were a ****ing joke... I literally yelled that at them, got in my truck and drove off during Thanksgiving.

My Step-mom and Father are now divorced and aren't religious anymore because they also felt betrayed by religion. My brother is 14yrs old and still can't walk or talk... he bangs his head with the palm of his hand when he's hungry. Imagine how strong I feel on this issue and ask me if I believe in any of it.

Another on that note....

Good friend of the family got breast cancer a few years ago. Very religious people. My aunt would go over to their house a few times a week because she was good friends with this woman. She would take her brochures for cancer institutes and different treatments but these people (husband too) would refuse to even look at them saying that God was going to cure her. At one point they kicked her out because she kept bringing in the cancer information hoping one day that they would wise up and see a specialist about this. They didn't. The woman died this last summer and left behind a beautiful little girl of 8 years old. I mean how do these people think like that? :confused: I mean the Lord gave you a brain to think for yourself with ya know?

So IYHO, generally all liberals are too radical to accept Bush as a president, but, on the other hand, all conservatives are generally moderate enough to accept a democratic president.

They may not have accepted it but they certainly would have driven-on by now.

In response to some of these posts, it is asanine for religious extremists to simply do nothing when it comes to administering the right medicine / care. And the biblical base for that is non-existent.

Another on that note....

Good friend of the family got breast cancer a few years ago. Very religious people. My aunt would go over to their house a few times a week because she was good friends with this woman. She would take her brochures for cancer institutes and different treatments but these people (husband too) would refuse to even look at them saying that God was going to cure her. At one point they kicked her out because she kept bringing in the cancer information hoping one day that they would wise up and see a specialist about this. They didn't. The woman died this last summer and left behind a beautiful little girl of 8 years old. I mean how do these people think like that? :confused: I mean the Lord gave you a brain to think for yourself with ya know?

Once again, this DOES NOT represent the mainstream, but a super-small faction of folks from all religions.

You need to be willing to walk through a door if it opens. In my opinion, having someone push you to see a specialist is that open door.

Yeah but the religious right sure does hate gays. Which is wrong to enforce your beliefs on others. And that doesn't include abortions.

Nope... not even in the slightest, Chris.

I actually think Democrats are in for another rude awakening if they think Hillary will win in 2008. Some Democrats may think this country is ready for a woman in office but I'd put all my money on the donkey party getting slammed by the vast majority of Christian, Catholics, LDS's and those that are for a more traditional family. Hell, I bet half of the Democratic party's men will follow suit and vote against her too because they’ll be damned if a woman is bringing home the bacon.

I disagree. Hillary is the wrong person for the right role. We ARE ready to elect a woman as President, just not her. And there don't appear to be any other women with enough recognition to mount a challenge just yet.

Anyways this election scares the crap out of me honestly. I can get drafted IF it happens. (Yes salty i know, but im saying if because I believe if it gets worse over there something will have to be done. And I believed either Kerry or Bush would have to do it.) I'll start a seperate thread.

Get in line behind all the <35 year old prior service enlisteds. :( I really don't see a draft happening anytime soon though. Enlistments aren't down, we all know what happened to the country before we abolished it the last time, and besides, we just voted a draft dodger in over a decorated veteran. It would be a pretty damn ballsy move.

Let's just be clear that this sort of thing is not the norm for religious folks. Even MOST Christian Scientists do take their children to the doctor, and they are the ones who think diseases don't exist.

Agreed. Religious faith in itself is almost always a virtue. It's those who push their faith on those who don't wish it that perpetuate the conflict between the religious and those who choose not to be.

I think Kerry losing the election has made me start to think very logically...


can someone explain this?

Why do you think I started all these threads? I'm trying to figure out why what I wanted to happen didn't, and taking a fresh look at my own perspectives and views.

They may not have accepted it but they certainly would have driven-on by now.

I think complaining about it and not accepting it are two different things. You've heard it said before- the single biggest reason to vote is so you can ***** if things don't go how you want them to. :p

Once again, this DOES NOT represent the mainstream, but a super-small faction of folks from all religions.

You need to be willing to walk through a door if it opens. In my opinion, having someone push you to see a specialist is that open door.

Agreed, again. Too often people who dislike people with strong faith leap to the extremist examples. Those with strong faith do it too, and I always find it annoying from both sides.

They may not have accepted it but they certainly would have driven-on by now.

So, are you admitting your mistake in reasoning? Who is 'they' in your post?

sorry everyone i edited my post.... i ment demorat!

haha
edgar, :)