<snip>RABAT, Morocco -- For more than a decade, Osama bin Laden had few soldiers more devoted than Abdallah Tabarak. A former Moroccan transit worker, Tabarak served as a bodyguard for the al Qaeda leader, worked on his farm in Sudan and helped run a gemstone smuggling racket in Afghanistan, court records here show.

During the battle of Tora Bora in December 2001, when al Qaeda leaders were pinned down by U.S. forces, Tabarak sacrificed himself to engineer their escape. He headed toward the Pakistani border while making calls on Osama bin Laden's satellite phone as bin Laden and the others fled in the other direction.

Tabarak was captured and taken to the U.S. Navy base at Guantanamo Bay, Cuba, where he was classified as such a high-value prisoner that the Pentagon repeatedly denied requests by the International Committee of the Red Cross to see him. Then, after spending almost three years at the base, he was suddenly released.

Today, the al Qaeda loyalist known locally as the "emir" of Guantanamo walks the streets of his old neighborhood near Casablanca, more or less a free man. In a decision that neither the Pentagon nor Moroccan officials will explain publicly, Tabarak was transferred to Morocco in August 2004 and released from police custody four months later.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2006/01/29/AR2006012901044.html

At least we got those WMD's :rolleyes:

So other then spreading more negative, anti-American news, what's the purpose of your post?

So other then spreading more negative, anti-American news, what's the purpose of your post?

Dissent is not anti-American. Only a fascist would suggest that it is so.

"Dissent is the highest form of patriotism"

-Thomas Jefferson

You're correct, with the exception of me being a Fascist.

So, what do call some one that obviously has nothing positive to say about their country?
Fascist?
Patriot?
???

Hey, lo, how 'bout you & I play a little role reversal.
You post Right Wing stories and I'll post Left Wing?

I'll go first:

George Bush is stomping on the American Constitution and slowly removing American's rights. He obviously thinks that it's the "Bill of Customs" and the "Bill of Rights."

A lot of people, I understand, disagreed with that decision, and that's what democracy is all about, that's what we believe in. We believe you can disagree. There's a custom in our country for people to express themselves, and it's good. It's what makes us a great country, that people can stand up and tell people what's on their mind. And we're going to keep it that way. It's very important for those who didn't agree with the decision, though, to understand the consequences of success in Iraq. It's really important we succeed, for a lot of reasons.

WTF?! Freedom of Speach is just a custom?!

Grab the pitchforks!!

So you're saying that every time you post a negative thread which is damn near every time, that it’s meant to be dissenting and not pessimistic? I call serious bull****, especially when there's always some smart-ass sarcastic comment buried within such posts from you. But who are we to say otherwise? It's a nice enough cover to slip by radar but not enough to fool a lot of us that know what true liberalism is capable of.

"True liberalism" would be what they have in Sweden, Canada, etc...and it's capable of being damn near a utopia.


I think you mean liberal extreamism Salty (nut jobs that claim liberalism; sort of like Pat Robertson to the conservatives. both sides has them)

Well Canada, Sweden and other countries "true liberalism" have been very capable of scrutinizing the USA in a pessimistic way. So I think both would apply in this case.

Hey, if they're right they have the right to scrutinize pessimistically....

So you're saying that every time you post a negative thread which is damn near every time, that it’s meant to be dissenting and not pessimistic? .

I've never said I'm not pessimistic about this administration. In fact, I think I am pretty clearly so. Nobody said one cannot dissent and be a pessimist. This administration has given me no cause to be optimistic.

I think your qoute taken from TJ is a little out of context. Don't you?

^^I don't know what he thinks, but I think this type of situation is EXACTLY what Mr. Jefferson had in mind when he said that. Out of curriosity, what do you think the proper context for that quote is?

I think your qoute taken from TJ is a little out of context. Don't you?

Nope. Put in context by Jeffery Stone, professor of law at the University of Chicago:

In 1798, when the nation was on the verge of war with France, Federalist newspapers in
defense of President John Adams characterized Thomas Jefferson, James Madison and
their followers as the "worst and basest of men" who were "preying on the vitals of the
country." During the Civil War, defenders of the government attacked their critics as "artful men, disguising their latent treason under hollow pretensions of devotion to the Union."

I believe that this quote was taken from TJ as he spoke in regards to GB. Dissention from England is the highest form of patriotism. Don't get me wrong the founding fathers were brilliant. Not everything they said can stand the test of time. After all, a brilliant scholar once said the world was flat. Why doesn't anyone quote that guy???

a brilliant scholar once said the world was flat. Why doesn't anyone quote that guy???

It was the catholic church's position that the earth was flat. The brilliant scholar (gallileo) proposed that the world was spherical.

Lo care to explain you quote from J.Stone. IMO it negates your arguement. Maybe I'm not reading it correctly or understanding it right.

It was the catholic church's position that the earth was flat. The brilliant scholar (gallileo) proposed that the world was spherical.
You missing the point.

The original quote from Thomas Jefferson was NOT in reference to the revolutionary war and does, in fact, say that dissent of your own government is patriotism. The second quote shows why TJ said that; because he (and some other founding fathers) were against a war and were being lambasted as un-patriotic by the administration...



sounds so damn familiar, funny how history repeats itself. We can all agree that Jefferson was a model patriot despite his (sporadic) dissent of the government, no?

Relevant to the conversation in many ways:

http://jurist.law.pitt.edu/forum/forumnew50.php



We are responsible for the actions of our government. When it fails to act in a moral and lawful manner, we must speak out and educate our fellow citizens about the abuses. If we fail to dissent for fear of governmental retaliation, we will have confirmed the truth of Hermann Goering’s frightening prediction.

Again, my sig FTW.

Good find MV. I stand corrected. It still doesn't change that lo is a hater. Lots of problems no answers.

Good find MV. I stand corrected. It still doesn't change that lo is a hater. Lots of problems no answers.

we must speak out and educate our fellow citizens about the abuses.

You do not know a damn thing about me or what I do in the real world. I work damn hard to hold my elected officials to a high standard, and if they fail us, I work damn hard to boot them from their jobs.

I represent my precinct at the county level in the DFL, and within a year I will be running for either the school board, or city council.

To tell you the truth, I really don't give a damn who you are or what you aspire to do. It'll be interesting to see your dissention from the system once you are part of it.

You do not know a damn thing about me or what I do in the real world. I work damn hard to hold my elected officials to a high standard, and if they fail us, I work damn hard to boot them from their jobs.

I represent my precinct at the county level in the DFL, and within a year I will be running for either the school board, or city council.

I'd say "God help the children in your district", but since you're an atheist.....

But seriously, good luck in your quest for World Socialist Domination!!

whoops posted in the wrong thread...

I've never said I'm not pessimistic about this administration. In fact, I think I am pretty clearly so. Nobody said one cannot dissent and be a pessimist. This administration has given me no cause to be optimistic.

I guess you're right... you can be a *****y, whiny, pessimistic patriot. Carry on.

To tell you the truth, I really don't give a damn who you are or what you aspire to do.

I request you cease maligning me due to your ignorance.

I would just like to say this about the original topic:

1) Do you think that there is the possibiity that there is A LOT of intelligence following this guy where he goes. Hoping that a certain someone might contact him out of the wood work? It may be far fetched, but it's a posibility. Afterall, he was the right hand man of OBL.


now, to touch on another thing Lojasmo mentioned: (this is not a stab at you at all)

From what I got, you work for your elected officials at the County Level. Maybe a State Rep? If so, why not run for a position with a little more influence than the local School Board or City Council. I'm not sure for which town you're running for a Position. But if it's a nice sized town, then go for it. I'm just used to the small farm town that I grew up in.
Why not run for a County position?

I would just like to say this about the original topic: I'm not sure for which town you're running for a Position. But if it's a nice sized town, then go for it. I'm just used to the small farm town that I grew up in.
Why not run for a County position?

Right...the other option is county commissioner. That's on my list too. Thanks! :)

Our city has about 100,000


I'd say "God help the children in your district", but since you're an atheist..... The fact that I'm an atheist doesn't preclude you from practicing your voodoo.

Right...the other option is county commissioner. That's on my list too. Thanks! :)

Our city has about 100,000
Awesome! Well good luck with your campaign. Are u going to run this year or next, or when?

The fact that I'm an atheist doesn't preclude you from practicing your voodoo.

:rotfl:

I just sacrificed a chicken in order to aid your political aspirations.

Awesome! Well good luck with your campaign. Are u going to run this year or next, or when?

LOL...probably in the fall electoral cycle. My wife just started a new (50HPW+) job with lots of traveling, so I'm gonna have my hands full with my full time job and the boy.

We'll have to see how things shake out....but probably in the fall, for whatever seat comes up for election.
I just sacrificed a chicken in order to aid your political aspirations.


Woot. Don't forget to make a necklace from the bones.